# Battery > Computer > Motherboard



## oscaryu1

Is there an small but strong enough battery (rechargeable) than I can use an inverter and get it to 120V and power an PC offa it?

Or is there such thing as an "Battery PSU"?


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## PC eye

APC is the big name in backup power supplies. Businesses use these often in the event of blackouts to prevent losses of data. Generally they won't give you more then about 2hrs. of time in order to save your work. Their main product page is found at http://www.apcc.com/products/category.cfm?id=13&subid=5

 Just at one shopping site where prices between vendors are compared the APC name always comes up the most as the leading brand while there are various types available. http://www.nextag.com/serv/main/buy...backup&OVKWID=110965608011&OVADID=14411433511


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## oscaryu1

No no I need like an portable battery for my desktop... It's about an project... (shh!)

How many mAh do you reckon I'll need to power an Celeron 1.2Ghz, generic mobo, 512MB, FX5200, mic + headphones, 24x CD rom drive, 300W PSU, floppy USB mouse + keyboard...


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## PC eye

A 12v battery for an auto would see all the amps you would ever need. But it mainly depends on the type of battery used. That decides how many are needed. Then you have to work out the means of connecting the power more directly bypassing the ac supply. That won't take a 12v dc input. The board will however once a standard connector is wired correctly.


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## oscaryu1

I suck at electronics (at this stage of life).. Is there an good and small (like ones that will fit in an 2" binder?) Maybe Li-Po's?


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## PC eye

One solution for you there is one used for businesses. These dc to dc supplies that include 12v dc input from cars, boats, and other 12v dc power sources. http://www.powerstream.com/DC-PC-12V.htm


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## oscaryu1

Arg the prices! I'll stick with wired...


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## PC eye

You might a lower price for one somewhere else if you shop around some. Usually by searching for a specific make and model or type you'll come across a shopping site with a few links comparing prices seen at different vendors. But that product line seen there is a start for what you are looking for.


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## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> You might a lower price for one somewhere else if you shop around some. Usually by searching for a specific make and model or type you'll come across a shopping site with a few links comparing prices seen at different vendors. But that product line seen there is a start for what you are looking for.



So your sure that you definitly need an huge battery to power an computer? Computer as in an Celeron 1.2/1.3GHz, Stock generic motherboard, FX5200...


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## brian

well my laptop. duel core turion 64 at 1.8 w/ a 17 inch monitor for 3 hr on a 14.4 V 63 Wh battery. so i mean you could get a good 12 cell battery and may run it for 3 hr. maybe.


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## oscaryu1

Yesss.. thanks! really helped. I'll be using an tiny CPU fan, laptop HDD, onboard sound, and that stuff anyways  anyone know how to hook those up?


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## PC eye

It depends on how long you will need the system to run. The supplies in that product line seen there are for application of other types of power sources other then an sc outlet. Is this some type of school project or for travel? For some demonstration you would need an adequate power cell for the quick temp application. 

Those supplies are intended for recreational vehicles like camper trailer types, large boats like yachts, and even mobile trailers used by businesses even contruction sites. A car battery or special battery pack would be the thing that would supply enough amps to meet the draw a desktop even an older one would place on it.


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## oscaryu1

Hmm... so I guess I'll need alot of amps? An car battery is eh... too big to carry around...


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## PC eye

saw one thing about a 60w dc type supply you apparently mounted in a pci slot for powering a desktop from an external source. But only 60w? I would be skeptical with something like that working out well.

 Spmething like a car or tractor battery would be obviously oiut since you can't carry the rest of an auto along with you for the alternator in order to recharge the car battery! 

 There are some ac to dc adapters that see an auto type 12v plug for using something like a car stereo on ac. But those would also serious lack the needed amperage for a desktop. Something like the APC product line for batter backups is still the best idea to look into there. Those are designed for pc application when ac power is out. Those are simply recharged later after the short term use they offer.


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## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> saw one thing about a 60w dc type supply you apparently mounted in a pci slot for powering a desktop from an external source. But only 60w? I would be skeptical with something like that working out well.
> 
> Spmething like a car or tractor battery would be obviously oiut since you can't carry the rest of an auto along with you for the alternator in order to recharge the car battery!
> 
> There are some ac to dc adapters that see an auto type 12v plug for using something like a car stereo on ac. But those would also serious lack the needed amperage for a desktop. Something like the APC product line for batter backups is still the best idea to look into there. Those are designed for pc application when ac power is out. Those are simply recharged later after the short term use they offer.



Why do you always seem offline? 

I was told going from DC to AC back to DC is unefficient...

I'm going toward more efficient CPU now. an mobile cpu.. would that help?


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## PC eye

You still have to recharge any battery power after so long. For a mobile cpu then you are looking at a mini desktop with a laptop type board installed into it. Those are intended for running off of the standard lithium batteries you would see in a laptop or notebook portable unit. Those would be limited to the amount of drives/devices you could add in however.


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## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> You still have to recharge any battery power after so long. For a mobile cpu then you are looking at a mini desktop with a laptop type board installed into it. Those are intended for running off of the standard lithium batteries you would see in a laptop or notebook portable unit. Those would be limited to the amount of drives/devices you could add in however.



Snap! With The_Other_One's help, he figured:

Celeron 566 - 11.9W
Sempron 2600+ - Over 60W..

Kinda obvious which one im choosing lol 

Going to upgade the Celeron anyways... Thank god for that beautiful Gigabyte moterhboard...


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## PC eye

A Celeron won't see the power demand a Sempron or P4 would see. But those are more powerful cpus overall. I don't think you are planning a portable gaming until otherwise you would asking about high powered battery setups.


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## ceewi1

Have you given much thought as to what sort of monitor you'd use?

Going from DC to AC back to DC is really going to hurt the efficiency.  What sort of PSU have you planned on using?  I'd be inclined to look at a DC to DC PSU.  There are a few available here: http://store.mp3car.com/SearchResults.asp?Cat=22

I've never used this product before, but it looks like it might suit your needs provided you could adapt the connectors (or that they fit as they are): http://www.sarrio.com/sarrio/12voltlaptop.html

If you're using a battery to power the system, you'll really need a 'PSU' which regulates 12V (something like the picoPSU won't, it relies on the 12V being constant).  Batteries aren't always good at maintaining constant voltage, which could be quite dangerous to a computer (although there are ways around that as well, it involves adding more circuitry).  Make sure that the DC-DC PSU can deal with a reasonably wide range of input voltages.

As you've probably gathered, this will end up being quite expensive.  Additionally, you can expect a typical 17" LCD monitor to draw around 35W, which will push up your power consumption quite a bit.  A 90Wh battery (if you're given capacity in Ah, just multiply that by the output voltage to get Wh) might only power it for ~1.5 hours.

If you're not so fussed about a battery, something like a 120W picoPSU might be a good idea for you: http://www.mini-box.com/picoPSU-120-power-kit?sc=8&category=13.  It's small, very efficient, relatively cheap, and should provide ample power for the sort of system you have planned.

Hope this is some help to you.


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## oscaryu1

Been to minibox. I choose their wide voltage one. There would be an chance that my battery might go down in voltages an bit, so an wider variance could prevent that.


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## PC eye

This is why the Powerstream supply mentioned before would see a 12v dc input and regualtion at the same time over simply patching a raw 12v source into the main power. You can take a second look at this type at http://www.powerstream.com/DC-PC-12V.htm

 Another one only saw a 60w total output for the pci type of mounting where you plugged in the dc source to that and not to the board directly would be a bad move to start off with. That 250w model at the link ceewi1 provided does show the higher price tag to see an adequate output depending on the total amount of hardwares you are planning.


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## oscaryu1

Too big, and price is horrible.. so the picoPSU won't work?


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## oscaryu1

http://store.mp3car.com/M2_ATX_160W_Intelligent_DC_DC_PSU_p/pwr-027.htm

Looked at that one..

So i can use my 11.1V E500 battery with that? Then the 4pin becomes an issue.... 

Soooooo... 

Here's what I got:

http://cgi.ebay.com/M2-ATX-DC-DC-AT...ryZ80172QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/2-PCS-4-Pin-Pow...ryZ45342QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/P4-Pentium-IV-M...ryZ45342QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem

^^ Will that work for an AMD board? Their the same if I'm not mistaken...

So how well will that do? I am going to TRY to install an voltage meter on the binder, so I can monitor the voltages as I work... good idea or not?


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## PC eye

A first look shows that model supply is for a strictly low power requirement with either a AMD or Intel P4 setup. That means only the bare essentials and no extras. This is why I was pointing at the 250w to meet the basics and leave some extra available. But EBay?

 One thing to note about any voltmeter is that it will only measure one voltage only and not things like voltage for the cpu. memory, and video if using something other then a vpu chip found onboard. That's why there are things like the hardware monitor in the bios and programs like Everest, PC Wizard, and a few freewares like SpeedFan and the SIW tool found at http://www.gtopala.com/siw_on_pc_world.html


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## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> A first look shows that model supply is for a strictly low power requirement with either a AMD or Intel P4 setup. That means only the bare essentials and no extras. This is why I was pointing at the 250w to meet the basics and leave some extra available. But EBay?
> 
> One thing to note about any voltmeter is that it will only measure one voltage only and not things like voltage for the cpu. memory, and video if using something other then a vpu chip found onboard. That's why there are things like the hardware monitor in the bios and programs like Everest, PC Wizard, and a few freewares like SpeedFan and the SIW tool found at http://www.gtopala.com/siw_on_pc_world.html



Eh? How much wattage does an motherboard, CPU, and GFX take up anyways? My processor is 25W, FX5200... and an VIA type motherboard...

And yes this is an AMD setup... AMD 2600+

250W is alot, I'm probably not going to get it unless it's 100% needed... I'ma use it for the lowest settings Halo 1 , and BF2... And I WILL downclock my FX5200 and  CPU if I need to...


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## PC eye

The 2600+ would see about 65w if not 89w max there with no ocing involved. That was never a good one for that anyways. I can assume the FX5200 is a 128mb card there using a bit less that going with a newer 256mb model which would put a slightly higher demand on. But at 89w and what for an lcd? you are close to 200w there already. By the time you have everything calculated you will see why I pointed at the 250w model.


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## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> The 2600+ would see about 65w if not 89w max there with no ocing involved. That was never a good one for that anyways. I can assume the FX5200 is a 128mb card there using a bit less that going with a newer 256mb model which would put a slightly higher demand on. But at 89w and what for an lcd? you are close to 200w there already. By the time you have everything calculated you will see why I pointed at the 250w model.



*sigh*

There are 2 types of AMD Semprons...

The GEORGETOWN Sempron 2600+, and the SONORA Sempron 2600+..

GEORGETOWN 2600+ = 62W

SONORA 2600+ = 25W

And I have CPU-Z running... Sonora... Or Codename : Sonora..

Informatino from:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_AMD_Sempron_microprocessors#Mobile_Sempron

And the screen has another battery... lots of stress offa the battery.. 4.2k RPM hdd, USB dvd, floppy, mouse, keyboard...


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## PC eye

Here I ran the XP2600+ model not the Semprons which were 89w while the one you mentioned earlier was over 60w for the Sempron. Add that to what the board, memory, video card, and lcd draw and you'll still upwards of 200w coming fast. Plus you still want to game while even on low settings less is drawn through the video card while still placing loads on the cpu and memory. But it really comes down to what else will you have installed or simply leaving room for any expansion seen later.


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## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> Here I ran the XP2600+ model not the Semprons which were 89w while the one you mentioned earlier was over 60w for the Sempron. Add that to what the board, memory, video card, and lcd draw and you'll still upwards of 200w coming fast. Plus you still want to game while even on low settings less is drawn through the video card while still placing loads on the cpu and memory. But it really comes down to what else will you have installed or simply leaving room for any expansion seen later.



.... 

Please re-explain. I just pointed out that my Sempron is 25W, with proof... Rather everything is still adding up to 200W. The screen has it's own 12V or whatever volts power source. it is an AGP 128Mb AGP Video card. If there is one that is the same/better that takes up less power, I would like to know. CPU, I am willing to downclock. 25W is already low. and if you see my "setup" I typed in, it's an 160W, if everything I listed works out correctly, which I why I called your here, to see if everything will work.

The RAM is an 512MB Stick, HDD is 4.2K RPM, low GB, 2.5", And everything else is USB. 

Battery will have this load:

Motherboard, GFX, RAM, CPU and thats it (mouse + keyboard, and the occassional DVD or floppy drive, both driven off of the USB power source. Thanks all I want).

Screen:

Speakers, and Screen. I am pretty sure I can do this. After you have made sure I have all the hardware right, we'll proceed to the screen.

And AMD MOBILE SEMPRON not Athlon please.


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## ceewi1

Unfortunately I don't have power consumption figures for a card as old as an FX5200, but an AGP slot is only capable of providing 41.8W of power, and the FX5200, being a lowend card, was nowhere near pushing this.  I would guess around half this much or less.

You should be fine with a 120W or 160W PSU.

Have you considered how you'll connect the battery and charge it?  Also keep in mind that the battery will not last as long with this system as it would with a laptop (and if it's an older battery that really won't be long).

Other than that your plan looks good to me.  Would be interested to hear how it turns out.


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## PC eye

I think ceewi1 would understand why a heavier supply would see an improvement in regulation even while the wattsge actually needed would be less. If you total just the 25w with the cpu, 40w or slightly less for an older AGP card, and let's say 35w for an lcd that alone sees just about 100w there. 

Now add memory, drives, and most likely onboard sound which will pull when gaming.. You're probably looking at 135-150w for a total. I would give the 160w a look to cover the basics with the 250w considered for any later expansion.


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## oscaryu1

The the charging may be an problem  Or I could one of my E500's as an charger. Otherwise, could yall suggest an good way to recharge it? Like putting an recharge in there?


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## PC eye

That will depend on the type of battery for the 12v source of power there. For auto you simply plug into the lighter socket and turn the key to accessories. Running a vehicle later sees that type of recharge by the alternator. For out of car use a car battery charger would be the method. 

The lithium batteries used in laptop obviously come with the charger supplied with the laptop itself. Those see recharging done while they are in the portable unit. But those are standard methods for standard 12v battery sources there. For a custom battery pack? Then you are looking at a custom method for trickle charging according to the type of battery or batteries used. 

Your best bet is to install the battery holder for the lithium type meant for use in laptops/notebooks and simply plug in a laptop ac-dc charging adapter while being limited to the 4hrs. of time available. The important thing to remember is the amps seen for output. A 12v source that generally sees a low draw is would simply wink on you when placing a larger load then it's rated for.


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## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> That will depend on the type of battery for the 12v source of power there. For auto you simply plug into the lighter socket and turn the key to accessories. Running a vehicle later sees that type of recharge by the alternator. For out of car use a car battery charger would be the method.
> 
> The lithium batteries used in laptop obviously come with the charger supplied with the laptop itself. Those see recharging done while they are in the portable unit. But those are standard methods for standard 12v battery sources there. For a custom battery pack? Then you are looking at a custom method for trickle charging according to the type of battery or batteries used.
> 
> Your best bet is to install the battery holder for the lithium type meant for use in laptops/notebooks and simply plug in a laptop ac-dc charging adapter while being limited to the 4hrs. of time available. The important thing to remember is the amps seen for output. A 12v source that generally sees a low draw is would simply wink on you when placing a larger load then it's rated for.



Well could you lead me to an good battery? Will more cells help? And if the battery is 11.1V will it hurt?


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## PC eye

Car batteries are generally 13.7 or 13.8v seeing a surplus in order to handle the heaveir loads there. When you place a good load on the voltage will srop fast if the amps aren't adequate as well as seeing good regulation. That will depend on the dc-dc supply used more then anything there however.

 As for the battery type that depends on how portable this is supposed to be and how long you will want it running. Are you planning to walk around with it or leave it in a stationary setup where you have a long list of options to look over?


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## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> Car batteries are generally 13.7 or 13.8v seeing a surplus in order to handle the heaveir loads there. When you place a good load on the voltage will srop fast if the amps aren't adequate as well as seeing good regulation. That will depend on the dc-dc supply used more then anything there however.
> 
> As for the battery type that depends on how portable this is supposed to be and how long you will want it running. Are you planning to walk around with it or leave it in a stationary setup where you have a long list of options to look over?



30mins is fine for me. Any more is good... Need it compact though, not an car battery. Maybe DSL or half an router size..... Just not subwoofer size.


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## oscaryu1

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=120167458679&sspagename=ADME:X:RTQ:US:11

So I can just connect that to any RCA output port and it works?


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## PC eye

That's an X-Box with a builtin tv tuner not a pc monitor there. The input from an X-Box seen internally not externally being a self contained unit. That's simply a portable X-Box with a builtin dvd drive in order to run the game disks and doesn't seen external input. You would need either a regular lcd screen from a laptop or external lcd monitor for what you are trying there.


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## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> That's an X-Box with a builtin tv tuner not a pc monitor there. The input from an X-Box seen internally not externally being a self contained unit. That's simply a portable X-Box with a builtin dvd drive in order to run the game disks and doesn't seen external input. You would need either a regular lcd screen from a laptop or external lcd monitor for what you are trying there.



Did you even read it?? 

It's an Xbox Screen, in other words an mini TV... And there is no TV tuner! The item for sale is not even an Xbox! There is no DVD drive either! ???!?


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## PC eye

It won't matter if it does or doesn't since that's an eintirely different signal that goes into that type of display. They also have entire portable units for X-Box with the drive included. Your best options are a replacement screen for a laptop or external monitor since those are designed for vga input and pc type application. The monitor there is for X-Box or tv receiver type input for display which is an entirely different type of signal.


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## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> It won't matter if it does or doesn't since that's an eintirely different signal that goes into that type of display. They also have entire portable units for X-Box with the drive included. Your best options are a replacement screen for a laptop or external monitor since those are designed for vga input and pc type application. The monitor there is for X-Box or tv receiver type input for display which is an entirely different type of signal.



Their's 2 different types of RCA?

Could you get me an LCD with an low power consumption that runs offa like an adapter? Not an 120W power outlet?


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## PC eye

Besides a regular replacement lcd for a laptop or an external monitor the one other option would be a moblie lcd that also runs on 12v. These are the type you mount on the dashboard of an auto and can be looked over at http://www.karpc.com/ Note they will suffer from the small 7" screen size over the larger ones like a 12-14" seen on a laptop.


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## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> Besides a regular replacement lcd for a laptop or an external monitor the one other option would be a moblie lcd that also runs on 12v. These are the type you mount on the dashboard of an auto and can be looked over at http://www.karpc.com/ Note they will suffer from the small 7" screen size over the larger ones like a 12-14" seen on a laptop.



Well thanks for the link, but you have not answered my question. Why is the RCA's difference? An Xbox is basically an computer with an type of emulation and O/S, and difference optical drive, so the output is just an regular GFX, right? So why won't my Svideo to RCA work? 

$80-90 max budget... And ifyou could answer the question above?


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## PC eye

If you have the s-video out option then you have to look at a display that has the same type of input. Usually that would be seen on larger tv sets and newer monitors. That's still a different type of signal where the video card itself has a converter built into as an option for use on other then the standard vga type of input seen with lcds as well as crts. 

The output on any X-Box or X-Box360 is very similar to that you see coming in from a cable box not pc. Both of those utilize the 75ohm RCA type connectors. The dvd type disks for X-Box are simply due to capacity while being in an entirely different format. To get a better understanding of what X-Box is even though it is a Microsoft product doesn't mean it is pc compatible. First the screen resolutions on a gaming system for tv are far less then needed for your average lcd's basci requirements. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X-Box

 What MS did with the 360 hoever is redesign the newer system for enabling the use of a crt or lcd for viewing that system's output since it now supported the minimum requirements of 640x480 and above. Plus you can play any dvd on the newer system. A good question and answer blog is this is seen at http://www.coldforged.org/archives/2006/11/10/xbox-360-high-definition-and-hd-dvd-faq/

 The thing to remember however is that you are connecting a pc to the display not any gaming system. The vga signal will not work on 75ohm being vga and not the composite signal from an analog source. The s-video is what allows for using a tv for a monitor since the vga signal is converted by the chip on the card.


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## ceewi1

There are a lot of portable batteries around, designed for using externally with laptops, which can charge by being plugged into mains power (and have a nice convenient power cable coming out).

With regards to the power consumption, you're probably looking at (approximately):
CPU: 25W
Video: 20W
Board: 25W
RAM: 5W
HDD: 5W
DVD: 5W
Keyboard & Mouse: Insignificant
Total: 85W

This is in the unrealistic situation that all components are receiving full power draw at the same time.

Adding a screen will push that up further, but if you consider the ~35W figure for a 17" LCD to be a maximum, you're still only talking about 120W=75% loading.  Still OK for a 160W (if you go the 120W route you won't be powering the monitor as well).

As for the monitor, if it does have a standard RCA port on it (make sure of it before buying), then conceptually it could work.  You may need to plug into an external monitor while installing drivers, etc...  Keep in mind that the image quality will be drastically reduced if using RCA.

There are also portable LCD monitors available, some of which have their own battery packs.  A laptop monitor wouldn't work easily (it's nowhere near as simple as plugging it in).


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## oscaryu1

OK Thank You. Can yall recommend me an cheap (preferable smaller) type of LCD that uses an adapter?


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## oscaryu1

Or is there an way I can use one of my E500 screens? I can solder, ect.


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## ceewi1

Here's a description of what's involved: http://www.geocities.com/p9019/lcdpanel


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## PC eye

I never said using a replacement lcd for a laptop would be easy. The problem with most portable lcd monitor even tv/monitors is the viewing size they offer. The links here will show a few lists as well as the prices typically found on them.

http://www.amamax.com/polcdmo.html has on camera and auto head rest types.

http://www.vfmstore.com/tv.htm offers low power consumption dual purpose lcds for the higher prices seen there. 

 The typical find from a search of shopping sites is seen at http://www.shopping.com/xGS-Portable_Lcd_Monitors~NS-1~linkin_id-8001687


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## oscaryu1

Hmm.. well Ceewi1... I've heard of that, but I cant seem to find an right type of board for my E500 screen... too old?

Only $200 outta my budget range.


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## oscaryu1

I spoke with Brian and ThatGuy16.... And ThatGuy16 suggest me use an Playstation 1 LCD screen, as his Intec 5.4" screen was poor in his opinion, and the PS1 screen was from Sony, not an non-known manufacturer.

So I got down to this:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Sony-PSone-5-In...oryZ1489QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Just an regular screen. Right? Adapter and everything included. Perfect. Great for the price

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=230179544406

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ BINGO! If that can convert an DVD / VCR to use with an PS1 screen, why can't I just use it for my computer?!?

http://cgi.ebay.com/New-VGA-to-S-Vi...ryZ41999QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Now I get that, and convert my 15 pin VGA to an RCA and Svideo, and connect the item from above to this...

And, BINGO! I got it right? Everything should work! VGA mod may be an option I'll have to see about...


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## oscaryu1

Bump?


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## oscaryu1

PC Eye? OMEGA? Ceewi1??! Anyone?

Bump...


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## PC eye

You must like small screens for gaming. Even laptops see at least a 12.1" display on the low end models. Maybe you use MS paint to give us a sketch of what this will look like for a better idea on how you can set this up. You still haven't answered one question asked earlier about how this will be used. Will you be carrying this around like a laptop or simply leaving it setup in one location lacking ac sources of course?


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## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> You must like small screens for gaming. Even laptops see at least a 12.1" display on the low end models. Maybe you use MS paint to give us a sketch of what this will look like for a better idea on how you can set this up. You still haven't answered one question asked earlier about how this will be used. Will you be carrying this around like a laptop or simply leaving it setup in one location lacking ac sources of course?



I already posted my config. 

Ceewi1 has already seen it and said it will work.

Small screens is probably the only choice. unless their an good solution under $75..

You have 2 hours before I place my winning bid on Ebay. The user has already comfirmed that I can use it on my computer/DVD player. I am using an seperate  battery pack for the LCD. Anyways, 5.4" isn't that small. $75 budget can't getcha anything, unless you want an 3" PS1 screen.. even worse.


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## PC eye

The idea was to see what you are going to be happy with before investing any money. The thing to note about EBay however is that is generally a one way street once you nuy something there as opposed to buying from a regular vendor like newegg or TigerDirect.


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## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> The idea was to see what you are going to be happy with before investing any money. The thing to note about EBay however is that is generally a one way street once you nuy something there as opposed to buying from a regular vendor like newegg or TigerDirect.



Meh 4K4W3 convinced me not too. Said my screen would be pixelated. But he also said that an 7" or so xbox screen would work rolleyes


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## PC eye

An X-Box screen is made specifically for gaming if that is all you intend there for a small screen. For text and other programs then you would have to start looking for a larger display intended for pc applcation. The one for a 360 not the original X-Box would be the one there.


----------



## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> An X-Box screen is made specifically for gaming if that is all you intend there for a small screen. For text and other programs then you would have to start looking for a larger display intended for pc applcation. The one for a 360 not the original X-Box would be the one there.



Thanks. So an Xbox will work?

Just not for word docs right?

I was planning on for BF2 and Halo, some Malplestory, some Runescape, Stick Arena, Robotrage, maybe some low resolution web browsing and email


So an Xbox will work with RCA ports correct?

Can the Xbox screen display 800x600?


----------



## PC eye

You would have to look over the MS indormation on their display since that is mainly intended for gaming systems. Primarily the gaming displays have always been lower the 800x600 while the specs will show for sure on that since HD tv would require support for the higher resolutions there. A good page on the X-Box 360 itself can be seen at http://www.answers.com/topic/xbox-360?cat=entertainment

How about an X-Box 360 laptop? http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/11/ben-heckendorns-xbox-360-laptop-best-mod-ever/ There's one for you. 

 For the actual screen resolutions you would see with a 360 setup the following lists the various ones typically seen.

*Q. Can I use my computer monitor as my display for the Xbox 360?*

A. *Yes, depending on the type of monitor you have.* And you will likely be able to play games in high definition too. The Xbox 360 supports the following resolutions when using the VGA AV connector: 640×480, 848×480, 1024×768, 1280×720, 1280×768, 1280×1024, 1360×768, and 1920×1080. In order to use your monitor you will most likely need to purchase the Xbox 360 VGA HD Cable and connect it to your monitor’s VGA port. If you don’t have a free VGA port on your monitor, you will either need to switch back and forth or purchase a VGA switcher.
Support for 1920×1080 was added during the Fall Dashboard Update in October 2006. There are many reports of some incompatibilities with various nominally 1080p displays including the Dell 2405.
http://www.coldforged.org/archives/2006/11/10/xbox-360-high-definition-and-hd-dvd-faq/


----------



## oscaryu1

Erm. So it CAN or CANNOT displayer 800x600? I'm not THAT good 

Soo.. I can hook it up, and it should work, aside from being an bit pixelated correct?

640x480 at least?

OMG! THAT IS AN NICE LAPPY!!!!!


----------



## PC eye

The resolutions there are what are seen with X-Box 360 games. But since you are connecting a pc not gaming system your desktop settings control the 800x600. That just shows that higher then that can be set for display like 1024x768 or 1280x1024. Different X-Box games would otherwise decide which resolution is seen according to the game's own design and settings for it.


----------



## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> The resolutions there are what are seen with X-Box 360 games. But since you are connecting a pc not gaming system your desktop settings control the 800x600. That just shows that higher then that can be set for display like 1024x768 or 1280x1024. Different X-Box games would otherwise decide which resolution is seen according to the game's own design and settings for it.



OK. Thank you. So if I bought an Xbox screen with RCA ports, bought an VGA to RCA adapter, I would be able to took the screen up, be able to run games, ect?

Thanks for all your help PC.


----------



## PC eye

The newer 360 display is far more suitable then the original X-Box display as far as compatibility. Make sure you get a quality adapter for use there. You don't want any cheap stuff that sees signal leaks and picks up outside inteferences.


----------



## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> The newer 360 display is far more suitable then the original X-Box display as far as compatibility. Make sure you get a quality adapter for use there. You don't want any cheap stuff that sees signal leaks and picks up outside inteferences.



So lets see this is what I would need:

QUALITY VGA to RCA adapter (gold or silver pins?)

Xbox/xbox 360 screen (either will work correct? RCA both rite)

and I just plug it in and blam! it works?


----------



## PC eye

You won't a cheapie adapter to say the least since gold is generally the best to start with there. You want quality conduction of signal there. For the display the best idea is to first ask someone who has actually used one for pc application or look into the Microsoft product information availble for some verification before spending on it. 

With the correct adapter type it should be a simple plug'n'play however. You just want to know how well it will work out for you there.


----------



## oscaryu1

So your say I should Microsoft Tech Support and ask them myself?


----------



## PC eye

That would be a thought if the call is free for you there. That's one source that should(we wonder some times hmmm...  ) be able to answer that on the spot since it's their product. You know already that there's no problem running things at a higher resolution for the 360 games or dvd playback.


----------



## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> That would be a thought if the call is free for you there. That's one source that should(we wonder some times hmmm...  ) be able to answer that on the spot since it's their product. You know already that there's no problem running things at a higher resolution for the 360 games or dvd playback.



Well right now your my expert. Seriously . Well I'll call them this week... if I can get one of their reps on..


----------



## PC eye

It would still be curious to see what some operator at MS has to say on this while a good and correct adapter should see that work for you. Other small lcds saw prices you didn't want to consider when looking around. Personal security lcds and others saw prices climbing up over $200!

Regular desktop lcd monitors generally see and ac to 12v wall adapter where the portable power source does go higher for the price. But since that while being a small display is already suited for gaming and multimedia I would talk their ears off a little to see what they have to say.


----------



## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> It would still be curious to see what some operator at MS has to say on this while a good and correct adapter should see that work for you. Other small lcds saw prices you didn't want to consider when looking around. Personal security lcds and others saw prices climbing up over $200!
> 
> Regular desktop lcd monitors generally see and ac to 12v wall adapter where the portable power source does go higher for the price. But since that while being a small display is already suited for gaming and multimedia I would talk their ears off a little to see what they have to say.



True, but it's HUGGEEE and I can't really find ones with 12V that are cheap, if at all. So according to you, it SHOULD work right? 


What is the diff between the Xbox and Xbox 360 screens anyways?


----------



## PC eye

The original X-Box display was limited to just that signal coming from the gaming unit since it was designed for that alone. With the 260 now seeing dvds instead of the old type of game cartridge is was then based on a more standard format seen with dvd players for tv and even pc as well. 

Naturally support for at least the 640x480 resolution and higher came with it. The old systems only supported low ends of the scale compated to the much higher seen on HD TV as well as pc. The 360 still won't be the best for pc but allow the portable gaming application you have planned there. The regular desktop lcd? car battery... blah blah blah and so forth.


----------



## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> The original X-Box display was limited to just that signal coming from the gaming unit since it was designed for that alone. With the 260 now seeing dvds instead of the old type of game cartridge is was then based on a more standard format seen with dvd players for tv and even pc as well.
> 
> Naturally support for at least the 640x480 resolution and higher came with it. The old systems only supported low ends of the scale compated to the much higher seen on HD TV as well as pc. The 360 still won't be the best for pc but allow the portable gaming application you have planned there. The regular desktop lcd? car battery... blah blah blah and so forth.



But an car battery would probably end the "portability" part  

Soo... 

The 360 might be better since it has been made to accept DVD signals?


----------



## oscaryu1

Waaaaiiit... The 360 screen is $149.99 itself! My 19" Widescreen LCD was less than that! How would an regular Xbox screen do now? I'm on an limited budget


----------



## oscaryu1

http://cgi.ebay.com/XBOX-LCD-SCREEN...ryZ20385QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


----------



## PC eye

Do you know I still haven't found one reference or guide for using an X-Box lcd screen for pc application? By searching you can find all kinds of references for hooking up a gaming console to a crt or pc lcd even HD lcd tv but none for using the X-Box or 360.


----------



## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> Do you know I still haven't found one reference or guide for using an X-Box lcd screen for pc application? By searching you can find all kinds of references for hooking up a gaming console to a crt or pc lcd even HD lcd tv but none for using the X-Box or 360.



Yeah, same here. I put in Xbox for PC screen, I come up with the exact opposite. I might call MS today.


----------



## PC eye

This is why I initially frowned when you first pointed the one you were looking for 360. Using tv screens as pc monitors and connecting gaming consoles to crts or larger pcd models is found all over. And that was also one reason for the idea on using a laptop's replacement display for a custom setup. 

I combined search engines with different variations of the search terms to still get nowhere for any good reference. As for the $149.99 price on the 260 model did you only look at one place or shop around some? The screen for the original would be out since that lacks the support for a variety of things like dvd playback for one. That was replaced by the more pc viable 360 system.


----------



## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> This is why I initially frowned when you first pointed the one you were looking for 360. Using tv screens as pc monitors and connecting gaming consoles to crts or larger pcd models is found all over. And that was also one reason for the idea on using a laptop's replacement display for a custom setup.
> 
> I combined search engines with different variations of the search terms to still get nowhere for any good reference. As for the $149.99 price on the 260 model did you only look at one place or shop around some? The screen for the original would be out since that lacks the support for a variety of things like dvd playback for one. That was replaced by the more pc viable 360 system.



Hmm, but the regular xbox screen would work?


----------



## PC eye

The 360 is the one that is dvd friendly with the newer format there. That's why people went crazy trying to be first in line when that first came out. The original X-Box screen is far from pc friendly and what you are trying to do there. That's why I suggested shopping around to see if you can find the 360's screen for less elsewhere.

$56.99 at   http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-INTEC-G8270...ryZ20385QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

 The main description that shows the differences between the 360 and the original should be reviewed at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xbox_360


----------



## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> The 360 is the one that is dvd friendly with the newer format there. That's why people went crazy trying to be first in line when that first came out. The original X-Box screen is far from pc friendly and what you are trying to do there. That's why I suggested shopping around to see if you can find the 360's screen for less elsewhere.
> 
> $56.99 at   http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-INTEC-G8270...ryZ20385QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
> 
> The main description that shows the differences between the 360 and the original should be reviewed at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xbox_360



THAT is my problem. 5.6" would be pretty pixelated wouldn't it? Or would the new format help it an bit?


----------



## PC eye

Well the first line of text in the reference there says: "produced by Microsoft, developed in cooperation with IBM, ATI, and SiS." in comparison to the original design for X-Box. Once you start talking IBM, ATI, SIS even NVidia, VIA, etc. you are looking more at a pc type or similar standard applied. The 360 was a total redesign by MS over the first version. That was more on the idea of Nitendo, Play Station, etc. seen there.


----------



## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> Well the first line of text in the reference there says: "produced by Microsoft, developed in cooperation with IBM, ATI, and SiS." in comparison to the original design for X-Box. Once you start talking IBM, ATI, SIS even NVidia, VIA, etc. you are looking more at a pc type or similar standard applied. The 360 was a total redesign by MS over the first version. That was more on the idea of Nitendo, Play Station, etc. seen there.



So, an smaller screen wouldn't matter due to the recreated hardware?


----------



## PC eye

The smaller the screen the less enjoyable for gaming while that is one of the few available besides looking at a laptop screen custom setup or a regular lcd with some type of 12v or actually 13.7v power source. So far the $149- was the lowest seen with the $199- seen anywhare else.


----------



## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> The smaller the screen the less enjoyable for gaming while that is one of the few available besides looking at a laptop screen custom setup or a regular lcd with some type of 12v or actually 13.7v power source. So far the $149- was the lowest seen with the $199- seen anywhare else.



Is there an possible larger screen around the same price?


----------



## PC eye

Well that's what we discussed earlier when you mentioned paying less for a desktop momitor. The small lcds for things like personal security cameras to watch the kids and for other applications all see high prices. Look at how popular the 360s are to see why the price for a screen stays high.

 The idea of custom installing a laptop's replacement display offered a larger screen there for the work it would take. But those are also likely to see a good steep price being a replacement part. If you found an old 14"-15" lcd the prices on those especially found during a clearance leaves you with the 12v situation again.


----------



## oscaryu1

Hmm... 15" would do, and couldn't I just use an CCTV 12V battery or so?


----------



## PC eye

Now you are getting somewhere. The thing is the additional cost of the monitor to go with something like the battery power adapter for lcds seen at http://www.dvwarehouse.com/Battery-...onitors-For-Sony,-Panasonic,-JVC-p-11152.html

Anyone for solar powered pcs? Tom's Hardware has an article on this seen at http://www.tomshardware.com/2007/09/25/technical_foundations_diy_solar_powered_pc/


----------



## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> Now you are getting somewhere. The thing is the additional cost of the monitor to go with something like the battery power adapter for lcds seen at http://www.dvwarehouse.com/Battery-...onitors-For-Sony,-Panasonic,-JVC-p-11152.html
> 
> Anyone for solar powered pcs? Tom's Hardware has an article on this seen at http://www.tomshardware.com/2007/09/25/technical_foundations_diy_solar_powered_pc/



Nice. EXCEPT, wheres the LCD?  

The solar look good, except how HUGE it is. How bout an small solar panel to slowly recharge the batteries? One for computer, one for the LCD?

Could you lead to an cheap small LCD? Preferable less than 15". As LCD's ARE big....


----------



## PC eye

One lcd for viewing footage from a camcorder was also big and saw a "big" price tag on that type of lcd viewing screen.  "my word!" There's all kinds of lcd monitors in different shapes and sizes seeing all kinds of prices. One seen for $77- wouldn't likely be one you would want. http://cart.shopping.ebay.com/ws/eB...cISAPICommand=ExpressCart&itemid=270178289480

 A 14" model is now seen for just over $100 at http://www.tigerdirect.com/applicat...Sku=M333-1418&SRCCODE=BIZRATE&CMP=OTC-BIZRATE


----------



## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> One lcd for viewing footage from a camcorder was also big and saw a "big" price tag on that type of lcd viewing screen.  "my word!" There's all kinds of lcd monitors in different shapes and sizes seeing all kinds of prices. One seen for $77- wouldn't likely be one you would want. http://cart.shopping.ebay.com/ws/eB...cISAPICommand=ExpressCart&itemid=270178289480
> 
> A 14" model is now seen for just over $100 at http://www.tigerdirect.com/applicat...Sku=M333-1418&SRCCODE=BIZRATE&CMP=OTC-BIZRATE



... Well I dont trust TD. Never gave me my Celeron D rebate from 3 years ago yet... Got any Newegg or Ebay's?


----------



## PC eye

That was found during a price search for 14" models at one of the shopping sites. Those give you links for various vendors once you find a good price. Most places don't even carry 14" lcds since they won't sell. newegg carries 15" as the smallest size as seen at   http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=2010190020+1309821307+4017&name=%24100+-+%24200 

 Here's what you typically see at a shopping site for 14" models.  http://www.calibex.com/14-lcd-monitor/zzcalibex2zB1z0--search-html


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## oscaryu1

http://www.amazon.com/Hannsprees-Plush-Elephant-LCD-Television/dp/B000A7W3H6

Ah-ha... do you think that'll work? Aside from the very childish casing? Which I could cut and burn?


----------



## PC eye

Yoiu have to be joking right? I doubt that has a 75ohm input jack but only the built in antenna seen there like any other small portable lcd. The old black+white small portable tvs saw an input jack many years back. But the small lcd tvs for kids seen these days as well as pocket sized? no way! Radio Shack or some other consumer electronics store will probably see a small tv with a jack on it.


----------



## oscaryu1

So, is there something SMALL ? And please rephrase that message, as I'm not THAT literate


----------



## PC eye

Now you are looking at battery powered tvs instead of a battery powered lcd monitor. You have to look around for one that is cable ready since that will have the 75ohm input jack seen on it. 

You should be able to find one in a local retail store easy enough if not at the usual online vendors. It was assumed you wanted a small pc compatible monitor with the 360 screen as a substitute. For kids tvs you can find those just about anywhere.  http://www.target.com/b/ref=sc_fe_l_3_10218751_2/602-6198041-0381455?ie=UTF8&node=277394011


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## oscaryu1

4-in-1 connection cable for S-Video, Composite Video and Audio. Headphone Jack, V-Chip, Closed Captioning and Stereo Speakers

^ It has those. Why can't it work? You can use an TV as an screen, for playing games, ect.


----------



## PC eye

If the tv you select for price has those inputs or the 75ohm where an adapter is then used you found yourself an answer for what to use for the display. Battery powered tv are far more common then lcds unless for camcorder and other purposes where the prices are usually much higher.


----------



## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> If the tv you select for price has those inputs or the 75ohm where an adapter is then used you found yourself an answer for what to use for the display. Battery powered tv are far more common then lcds unless for camcorder and other purposes where the prices are usually much higher.



Why is the power so minimal thought? 4.5V?


----------



## PC eye

Portable tvs that run off of batteries are designed to see a low power consumption. There's nothing unusual about that. Do you want batteries to quit in 5 minutes? That sounds like it takes three C or D sized 1.5v batteries. Hand held models would see AAs or AAAs size batteries being smaller.


----------



## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> Portable tvs that run off of batteries are designed to see a low power consumption. There's nothing unusual about that. Do you want batteries to quit in 5 minutes? That sounds like it takes three C or D sized 1.5v batteries. Hand held models would see AAs or AAAs size batteries being smaller.



Hmm, would you ADVISE me to use that? It looks great, I could easily just install bigger batteries (D's, maybe get an big 9V and lowering it <not the small 9V, the lantern 9V's>)


----------



## PC eye

You first have to find one that will have a self contained battery compartment for inserting the C or D type batteries. Some will have an ac adapter or at least a power jack for an external jack for one rated for a specific input. A model that runs on 9v would see six 1.5v batteries. 

For using a large lantern battery you would need to jerry rig by splicing the correct type of adapter plug and make sure to wire it correctly. You don't generally solder to a battery's contects however. Plus you haven't even selected a model to go with yet.


----------



## oscaryu1

But would you recommend that LCD?
 Most LCD TV's are pretty good correct?


Wait, it IS LCD right?


----------



## PC eye

I posted a link to several 15" model lcd monitors earlier carried by newegg.  One was for 14" models found at Calibrex with the last link for the 9 different portable tvs carried by Target. These simply show different model monitors or portable tvs to give you ideas there. Obviously the lcd monitor(quality brand that is) is intended for pc use while tvs have S-Video, DVI, and the like for seeing external input.


----------



## oscaryu1

Hmm... The LCD's are more expensive and use more wattage however.

Please answer -> Would you use an Xbox 360 screen or that 10" TV screen? 

-> Will the 10" screen even WORK?


----------



## PC eye

The 360 screen while much smaller is geared for dvd playback as well as the high resolutions seen in many X-Box360 games themselves. The tvs still take a standard analog or S-Video type external input. You already know that lcd monitors are still going to be pc type lcds displays. Some see 40w or more for a draw depending on make and model.

 I didn't specify one 10" tv. I simply posted a link for a page showing different tvs seen at Target some with 10" screens on them. Each one would still have to be looked over to see which ones operate on batteries and not simply a small tv you can throw on a table with an extension cord. 

Don't forget weight since portable tvs will be heavier then or as heavy as a standard lcd monitor. Some battery operated portable tvs have their own rechargable battery packs. That's another thing to consider there.


----------



## oscaryu1

Either I'm dumb, or I didn't get the answer. 

Question - Would you recommend an TV?

Answer (in my words) - Depends on the size, quality, and how it can... work with DVD's... right?


----------



## oscaryu1

Hmm, 7" XBOX (first ones) screens are pretty big... if you measure it from an 45 degree angle.


----------



## PC eye

You first have to remember what you are looking for there mainly a battery powered setup of everything. A laptop is self contained with a 4hr. typical average use time before recharging. Without a builtin display you now have to battery power an external display of some type.

 Not all portables will allow the input from external sources since they are simply self contained small tvx you can carry around. The lcd type tv come in all sizes while larger models usually expect external input from dvd players, analog and DVI sources with the newer ones out. But a 14", 15" desktop lcd monitor would also be awkward.

 The thing you have to do is decide what will best fit into your budget as well as suit your project there. Finding a low cost lcd tv with allowances for external sources with battery capability will be one task since there are all nrands, kinds. and sizes to look over. Then you have to convert vga to S-Video or DVI depending on what you find.


----------



## oscaryu1

Hmm, I was looking at this:

http://cgi.ebay.com/XBOX-LCD-SCREEN...ryZ20385QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem

Viewing experience might not be as good, but I'm not really worried about that. What type of power connector do you think it uses? What inputs?


----------



## PC eye

Now you are going back to the original X-Box and not the 360 there. The original simply won't work. You forgot that the 360 is where MS teamed up with IBM and ATI for that version's improvements and far more pc compatible standards. 

You looked at a 360 screen earlier and turned away due to the $150 price tag found at one place. This is why looking for another type of battery powered display like a small lcd tv with s-video/DVI capability has been the thought there.

 You seem to caught in an endless loop since you are going back to something already ruled out. Finding an adequate 12v portable source for a regular desktop type lcd monitor is out. Your last hope was finding a small portable and battery powered tv you could adapt for use as a monitor. 

Finding an older used laptop in good working shape would be the far easier way to simply run the older game there without it becoming a major project. Custom setups for a replacement laptop display would be costly and tedious to start with. Battery power lcd monitors are availble but see the higher prices there. For the price range you are working with there are not too many options to work with.


----------



## oscaryu1

No no, some of the origional Xbox screens have the capability to be used as DVD screens, thus it could be better, correct?


----------



## PC eye

You are forgetting one thing there. What's that? You are using this for pc not older dvd playback. The 360 was a total redesign to support higher resolutions as well as being much closer to the IBM compatible standards. 

For something that's actually going to work out for you there you are going to end up spending a little more then planned. This is why you were looking at battery powered tv with the tv/monitor dual purpose capability over lower priced lcds.


----------



## oscaryu1

So what you recommend ->

360LCD
Battery Powered LCD TV (correct?)


----------



## PC eye

What you have to decide on is what will both work and fit into the price range you have already set. You never did answer one question earlier however namely will this be set up in stationary manner or be constantly moved around? If you are simply setting it up in one location lacking ac power you have a wider range of options. But if you going to carry this all over the place from here to there to ..? what next then you have to look at the way laptops are setup.


----------



## oscaryu1

Well it depends, I was planning on like... well moving it around. That would require an less pwr consumption and more batteries needed right?


----------



## PC eye

If you are looking at moving it around quite a bit then having multiple rechargeable batteyr packs would seem the best move there. Since a laptop board is being used you know the answer for one battery type already namely finding a way to install a battery cage for the typical laptop battery to power the board, cpu, memory, video and sound.

 For the display that could be several rechargeable C or D batteries sometimes presealed in a plastic wrap. The battery pack in a cordledd phone can give you the idea on that.


----------



## oscaryu1

Erm... laptop board?

It's an 29W Sempron 2600+... and an motherboard... plus an 40W max FX5200... and an 4.2k RPM HDD... USB DVD and Floppy drive...


----------



## PC eye

Your early posts pointed at using a mobile type cpu not desktop. The draw by a laptop would be far less leaving a question remaining about battery power for the main case there. This is why I pointed out the concept of a car battery since that could handle the heavier loads a desktop system would place on 12vdc battery power. But that would quite awkward to lug around for sure.


----------



## oscaryu1

It's an mobile Sempron 2600+... but an desktop motherboard...


----------



## PC eye

That's where the demand for power will be a little higher on any battery setup you end up with. It's not only the board but the other hardwares besides the cpu that go with it. You're still trying to take a desktop on the road like it was a laptop. 

That doesn't specify highway travel but carrying everything around like you were carrying a portable unit. Most likely this will end up also needing some type of custom modded case to allow for some type of battery holder or carrying case for the 12v battery pack used.


----------



## oscaryu1

Hmm... The DVD & Floppy is coming out of the USB, no extra power... HDD is 4.2k RPM... laptop size... and just cheap headphones...

BAttery - What type would you recommend? Remember this is portable, so I cant lug around an 35lbs 12V car battery


----------



## PohTayToez

USB devices add to the power consumption as well, they just don't get power magically from nowhere. 

And as for the battery, somehow I doubt you'll find one that is any where near reasonably priced.  How long do you need the computer to last?

(And if you already answered that, don't get testy.  There are FOUR pages of replies and while I scanned through the entire thread, I'm definitely not going to read the entire thing in detail.)


----------



## oscaryu1

PohTayToez said:


> USB devices add to the power consumption as well, they just don't get power magically from nowhere.
> 
> And as for the battery, somehow I doubt you'll find one that is any where near reasonably priced.  How long do you need the computer to last?
> 
> (And if you already answered that, don't get testy.  There are FOUR pages of replies and while I scanned through the entire thread, I'm definitely not going to read the entire thing in detail.)



Don't need ta 

Battery... not really sure... Maybe an 9 cell laptop battery? 

This is going to be an gaming... BF2, Halo... lowest settings of course. But still..

11.1V probably, with how many mA/A do I need?


----------



## PC eye

A 9v battery won't work for a 12vdc system. In order to use 9v batteries you would then need a 9v to 12v stepup type of dc transformer. During that process the amperage suffers once a load is placed. You still have to go back and look at how laptops are powered to understand why their batteries only see a good 4hrs. of use before needing to be recharged.


----------



## oscaryu1

*AHEM*



> 9 cell


 <- You DO know what CELLS are right?



> 11.1V probably


 <- V and CELL ... Mixed up?


----------



## PC eye

Do you think a 9 cell is going to power a 12v system?  "gee i don't know?" Why do you think 13.7-13.8v is seen in automotive for 12v items there? The voltage drops when more amps are pulled. And micro amps in any value won't cut it for a desktop made portable. 

 A 9v cell won't power any 11.1v anything since that is underpower right there. For amperage needs first look at what amps are provided by a laptop battery to see only 4hrs. of use with an energy efficient combination of hardwares. 

Now try adding a desktop with a vga card over onboard to see that more will be required to see the same amount of running time available. As we went over amperages at the start of this thread you are looking at over 100.


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## oscaryu1

................................................................................................... I see where your going... but you don't really understand...


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## oscaryu1

That battey is an 11.1V with NINE CELLS.. the more cells, the more LIFE...

Liion battery CELLS :






What your referring to:


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## PC eye

You were talking a 9v lantern cell before. Now you are looking at flashlight batteries for the most part there. You are headed in the wrong direction with something like that unless for a small lcd tv that probably won't have any direct input for an adapter. 

Do you know how large a laptop battery is? Now imagine needing something larger to handle the draw placed by desktop type hardwares. That's why something more like a car battery will be able to provide enough amps to handle what you are trying to do there without necessarily being quite that large in size.


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## oscaryu1

I was? 9V and 9 CELL are different.. 

Car batteries are pretty big aren't they?


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## PC eye

For making a desktop portable and battery powered you will need a battery that can handle large draws on it for power. Small flashlight batteries can't handle the draw just seen when first starting a system despite that being an other set of hardwares there. 

A desktop will see a pull on the battery source almost as much as the starter on a small car in that sense. lantern batteries are designed for low draw over a lengthy period of time not heavy loads all at once.


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## oscaryu1

Ahh... wow...

An laptop battery is an lantern battery? 

Hmm... I might make this into an backpack lappy 

With VOIP, full telephone support.. maybe even an 72mhz channel intercept thing... like an spy pack


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## PC eye

You are the one that keeps bringing up using a 9v lantenr battery. That wouldn't work for anything on 12v hardwares. Besides a car battery which would be the only thing you would be able to carry in any back pack used leaving no room for anything else.... the idea of 12v batteries for electric start tractor mowers smaller in size would be one thought if 12v as well. Those generally see their own battery charger.


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## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> You are the one that keeps bringing up using a 9v lantenr battery. That wouldn't work for anything on 12v hardwares. Besides a car battery which would be the only thing you would be able to carry in any back pack used leaving no room for anything else.... the idea of 12v batteries for electric start tractor mowers smaller in size would be one thought if 12v as well. Those generally see their own battery charger.



I said 9 CELLLLLLL ! Not 9VOLTS!...

And I have an 9 CELL laptop BATTERY... that is ONE whole thing, the 9 cells total 11.1V...


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## PC eye

And the small batteries used for totally 11,1v still wouldn't provide the amperage for the draw placed on them by a desktop. The laptop using that setup was designed for a lower requirement then others. 

That reminds me of the old Epson HX-20 that saw 4 rechargeable C type batteries those many years back. http://oldcomputers.net/hx-20.html Talk about dinosaurs for laptops!  Try working on over 70 of them!


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## oscaryu1

WOW They had batteries back then?!?! 

WOW

 --- End

So, I think I'll use an backpack... with VOIP and an full Wireless N (or preN) +  telephone system... Yes, another crazy idea... but I have more room... now...

So, where should I get started? I can frame the backpack to make it stiff...


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## PC eye

With the HX-20s you could fit about 5-6 of those in a back pack easy enough. Now talking about dinosaurs take a look at the boards those had with 16kb of ram. "that was all?!  "  http://www.xs4all.nl/~fjkraan/comp/hx20/


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## oscaryu1

Man that's alotta RAM! I gotta get some more KB's..



Soo... I would have to use an 12V mower battery?


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## PC eye

For a  desktop you would a battery source that will handle the load placed on it. Those small batteries even when combined wouldn't handle the much larger draw that a desktop system will place over what you would generally see with a portable(laptop/notebook). 

Portables are made to see only a small load in order to extend battery life just to the 4hr. average. Now replace that with a regular case to see how fast would eat that up. At the same time any automotive type battery would be inadequate for lasting any good amount of time while having the amps available. Every forget to turn off head lights on a car and see the battery dead in 30min.? A lithium battery for desktops?


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## oscaryu1

Damn! What type of battery then?! :'(


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## PC eye

Offhand? I've never tried carrying a desktop around in a backpack. I didn't have a fork truck around for the old tape driven IBM mainframes in the late 60s either. sorry! 

 You will have to start researching 12v battery backups for pcs or something on that idea to see what you can come up with. Even those that go to lan parties at least have ac power avaialble or simply go for a laptop to make life far easier. You still haven't explained what you are using for a case for this.


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## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> Offhand? I've never tried carrying a desktop around in a backpack. I didn't have a fork truck around for the old tape driven IBM mainframes in the late 60s either. sorry!
> 
> You will have to start researching 12v battery backups for pcs or something on that idea to see what you can come up with. Even those that go to lan parties at least have ac power avaialble or simply go for a laptop to make life far easier. You still haven't explained what you are using for a case for this.



Hmm... well this might be going to an change 

How's an ITX motherboard? I can afford an  $60 low power comsumption... It would work wouldn't it? Just need an USB hub and an PCI fx5200....

^ Would that be an better idea ? Less power comsumption...


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## PC eye

You still haven't answered one question as if to avoid it. What type of case will all this go into? As you can see from the product page here the mini cases run at higher prices then the average mid tower model.  http://www.xoxide.com/small-form-factor-cases.html 

There are plenty of micro atx and ITX minis to select from for a board. But then you are looking at an old AGP card for the newer PCI-E boards now seen. Once you have all of the hardwares selected then you have to calculate the total consumption in order to see what type of battery power will be available as well as adequate.


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## oscaryu1

Case? Either the binder of backpack. There 

There was an $50 200W Dc-Dc PSU @ ebay..


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## PC eye

200w wouldn't be enough to start with. Even the smaller boards for desktop use are looking for a 300w starting point for just onboard video which is probably what you will end up with there. That would be one way to lower the power demand on a battery operated system while sadly lacking for any serious gaming. 

Battery backup setups for server cases are the item to look into since those take over when the ac is lost from a blackout. Note the three models seen on the right column when looking over the battery systems seen at  http://www.atbatt.com/ups-backup-batteries.asp


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## oscaryu1

... So my 2600+ wouldn't work? Even after getting vertified by you and Ceewi1 in the last pages?


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## PC eye

Why wouldn't it? You have to look at the entire system not just the cpu. Now you are looking at newer boards meaning a totally different socket type unless you find an older model someone is still caryying. You're talking about a 754 cpu if you find a 754 ITX model board if not micro atx model. The best of the 7 seen at newegg is an Asus micro atx model with a VIA chipset seen at  http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131129


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## oscaryu1

My CPU is an like an 25W one... Sempron Sonora 2600+ 

I have an K8M800 motherboard... VIA chipset... 

Basically what I have in my rig


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## PC eye

Despite the fact that you won't be system poiunding and ocing you'll probably end up needing more then what the typical laptop battery would supply. It's kind of like comparing apples to oranges in some sense. What's going to pull a heavier load a mini van or a full sized 4x4 pickup truck? to give you one example.


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## oscaryu1

Depends on what type of van 

So, we've eliminated 12V Car batteries and laptop batteries...

I'm getting an Micro ITX motherboard + CPU, that would suck less power would it not?

Ceewi1 we could use some help


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## PC eye

The rechargeable server backup battery would be the most likely type to see results there since that has to provide the current amount for any board other then one found in a laptop. A car battery while massive won't last long. Ever watch someone jump starting a car after forgetting to turn off the dome light overnight or parking lights for a few hours? Headlights usually see about 30min. before that is needed due to the heavier draw there almost what a desktop sees.


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## oscaryu1

hmm, how's an Surge Protector battery thingy? It's made to last... But not for very long... 

Yeah... well... ITX would lower the power consumption wouldn't it?


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## PC eye

An ITX board would fit into the micro atx type catagory with less features. But you are then talking about an entirely new board and cpu not the current mobile model you were planning to run. A newer board will also see the additional 12v cpu feed added into the works due to the newer power distribution. You defeat your own purpose there.


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## oscaryu1

My 2600+ also uses an 4pin 12V though ... 

Back to the Celeron 566?


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## PC eye

You never mentioned the socket type just that it was a mobile cpu being used there. When you say it's a 2600+ I keep thinking back to the older Socket A models. But for what you are doing there you will still need an adequate power source for a desktop. The idea of going for a battery rated for a higher draw is to see the battery used last longer then a typical laptop battery's 4hrs. max of useability before requiring a recharge.


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## oscaryu1

...

You do know in the last... 5-8 pages I listed everything?

"Everything in my sig" 

So an Mobile 25W 2600+ Sempron 754


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## PC eye

I was trying to get a look at the specifications at AMD and the cpu comparison chart for laptops list the S1 type socket at this time. That only listed down to a 2800+ in the Sempron and Atholon64 lines for the newer models.

 Regardless of the cpu used you will still be faced with the battery type selected. The stronger the battery as far as output the longer you can run with it without a need to recharge it. A laptop battery only lasts 4hrs. in a laptop. You might see 1/2 of that amount of time with the still larger draw even on a low end desktop case.


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## oscaryu1

brianmay27 said:


> well my laptop. duel core turion 64 at 1.8 w/ a 17 inch monitor for 3 hr on a 14.4 V 63 Wh battery. so i mean you could get a good 12 cell battery and may run it for 3 hr. maybe.



Exactly! I don't get how an MOBILE 25W CPU would even need near an 12V car battery!

I don't even need 3 hours (but it would be nice... )


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## PC eye

You don't seem to understand why a heavier battery will provide much longer life. Using a car battery as the ideal example is quick and easy here. What happens if you leave the head lights on after so long like a good hour? You need a jump! But you can leave the radio on overnight and what happens? crank crank zzzzoom! the car starts up! The radio didn't have the same large draw the head lights did and which quit first? Yet the battery has to handle both.


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## oscaryu1

Ahh.. so what type of battery would you recommend?


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## PC eye

Other then the 80w max you would see on an external laptop battery the only type known for pc application is those commonly used for servers. A car battery would be a lot cheaper then the actual battery you would need for running a desktop portable. That is unless you can locate a smaller verion of the one seen at  http://www.atbatt.com/product/20199.asp


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## oscaryu1

Ehh, no. That's... $300 outta my budget. I thought you said back then that an lappy battery would work!?!?!? I have an VERY low wattage CPU, and low voltage RAM...?!?!


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## PC eye

You can shop around all day for external laptop batteries. But those are wired to plug into the standard connections seen on portable units. That would mean custom wiring them for a desktop board if they worked at all. The power configuration is a little bit different on the boards used in laptops over atx.


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## oscaryu1

... Why not the 120W picoPSU connected to the Laptop battery?


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## PC eye

As ceewi1 already pointed out that may probably cover the basics only while the heavier 250w model would handle the gaming load. But you would still looking at a laptop battery expecting less of a draw not the power distribution seen with an atx board. Then it also depends on how long you intend to see a battery hold when in use. That's where the price factor comes in again.


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## oscaryu1

30 minutes is enough for me! I can upgrade/downgrade the motherboard? How can I calculate the power factor?


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## PC eye

If you go with a laptop board custom installed into a smal mini case somehow? you then have plenty of options for finding a way to install the battey holder needed for the typical lithium battery you would use with that make and model laptop's board. The power connections would then be standardized over trying to mickey mouse wire some other 12v source.

From there you would find the right video card for the board used. Replacement boards for laptop however may see a higher price over what you will find for desktops however. But you then would have upto 4hrs. of battery life and something designed for portable application. 

That also birngs to mind the thought of going for a used laptop in good shape for simply using it as a self contained unit or stripping it down for parts like the board, battery, and of course the battery powered lcd display.


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## oscaryu1

... Which is an kinda bad idea... Since I have no exp in taking an lappy apart...


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## PC eye

You would also need some metal working experience in order to custom mount a laptop board in a small atx case too. But with a complete working laptop that would solve the portable pc dilemna since everything is self contained there. You would simply upgrade from onboard to a better video card.


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## oscaryu1

Yeaahhh... but we're using an laptop, and unless I can find an good dedicated type laptop for VERY LITTLE... it's not gonna work well...


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## PC eye

But it's also a low cost option in some cases like http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/PCWorld/story?id=3818602 where commercial Linux laptops seem to be coming down(not good for BF2  ). Or you can get a 2 for 1 bargain on $100 models and see one donated.  http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/ZDM/story?id=3858659

Of couree you could always try running a super long extention cord since anything else found for consideration there runs at a much higher price. For seeing an atx type system or case used by strictly battery power you are rather limited on options.


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## oscaryu1

Yeah, that's the problem... The cost... How much does an mATX motherboard generally suck (as in wattage?)


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## PC eye

Wattage is measured as output while amps are measured as input. The question would be how many amps would a micro atx board draw. Figure the average budget case sees a supply with 15amps for a start on each rail while the better ones climb to 18-20. 

Any desktop board is still going to pull more then one for a laptop even a micro. The boards used in portable units are also limited to a few basics like HD, Optical, vga out, etc. while you RAID and other capabilities present even on micros.


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## oscaryu1

Well... then are there any "mobile" motherboards? That can support my mobile CPU? 

PS - Why are you always "offline"?


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## PC eye

The board to use would simply be any laptop replacement board that uses that model and socket type. What would a Socket 754 cpu go on? a 754 board. For a mobile 754 cpu you would use a mobile 754 board. The quality of the board depends on the quality of the laptop it goes into.

Due to constant interruptions as well as a few other projects I keep the inactive setting since I seem to be on 24/7 call due to someone close by with a serious medical condition. Plus I'm always trying out some new program that often requires a system restart. But these are something more for a pm then here.


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## oscaryu1

Hmm, would the cooler be a issue? And then the GFX... I'd have to have an Nvidia GO or ATI Mobility...

Eh, no I mean your light on the bottom. Never green.


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## oscaryu1

I picked up a UPS battery... not bad... but it doesn't work... I'm freezing it in the fridge right now. Hopefully it's a NiCD or NiMH...


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## PC eye

First you have to figure out just what you are going to end up with as far as a portable system. That ups sounds like a rechargable battery/surge protection strip combo that won't work first since it needs to charged while in use and 2) may not be the correct type for what tyou are trying to do there.


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## oscaryu1

PC eye said:


> First you have to figure out just what you are going to end up with as far as a portable system. That ups sounds like a rechargable battery/surge protection strip combo that won't work first since it needs to charged while in use and 2) may not be the correct type for what tyou are trying to do there.



I've been looking @ ups's, and some say they can power a computer for like 43minutes. Seeing I only need around 30 for some gaming... can't I just gut the system and use the battery?


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## oscaryu1

Bump. I think you've almost defeated me from making this


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## PC eye

You've been defeating yourself there. You are going to lug a desktop, monitor, and most likely large battery around for 30min. of gaming? For a 30min. ride on a bus, lunch break, or whatever a laptop would be the usual thought there. Most gamers will want something good for a few hours if needed.


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## oscaryu1

Meh ok  Thead closed.

PC Eye- THANK YOU ALOT for this information. Learned ALOT even in this dud of a project  THANKS


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