# Can i use a socket 775 CPU in a socket 771?



## douche

I have a Q6600 Core 2 Quad and wondering if i can use it on a socket J (771) board. LGA 775 and 771 sure do look awfully similar. I really hope it's possible. If not, how about vice versa?


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## mx344

I beleive the answer to that is no.


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## Cleric7x9

no douche


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## Zatharus

Double no.


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## pfig88

Zatharus said:


> Double no.


If you could use both in the same socket, wouldn't they be called the same thing?
the '771' and the '775' refer to the number of pins each processor uses (i think).  you do the math...


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## Zatharus

pfig88 said:


> If you could use both in the same socket, wouldn't they be called the same thing?
> the '771' and the '775' refer to the number of pins each processor uses (i think).  you do the math...




Yes that is correct.  You can't use one processor in the other slot in either case.  Even if you could physically fit the 771 chip in the 775 slot, the voltages and pin outs will _not _match.  You _will _fry the chip.


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## Cleric7x9

Zatharus said:


> Yes that is correct.  You can't use one processor in the other slot in either case.  Even if you could physically fit the 771 chip in the 775 slot, the voltages and pin outs will _not _match.  You _will _fry the chip.



not that it matters, but i doubt you would fry anything, it just wouldnt POST. you might bend the pins on the socket tho


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## Zatharus

Cleric7x9 said:


> not that it matters, but i doubt you would fry anything, it just wouldnt POST. you might bend the pins on the socket tho



Oh, it matters. 

It will damage the chip.  The interconnects are not the same for those two sockets, and as such, the voltages will differ on the pins that matter.  I would also consider bending/breaking pins damage.


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## Cleric7x9

Zatharus said:


> Oh, it matters.
> 
> It will damage the chip.  The interconnects are not the same for those two sockets, and as such, the voltages will differ on the pins that matter.  I would also consider bending/breaking pins damage.



yeah but you said "fry" not damage 

of course it would damage it. i just dont think it would fry anything.


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## Zatharus

Cleric7x9 said:


> yeah but you said "fry" not damage
> 
> of course it would damage it. i just dont think it would fry anything.



Yes, an improper voltage to the wrong pin on a CPU, _will _fry it.  ...smoke and everything if they are too far off.


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## Tuffie

No douche.


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## JTM

Zatharus said:


> Yes, an improper voltage to the wrong pin on a CPU, _will _fry it.  ...smoke and everything if they are too far off.



A little different scenario, but same concept. A kid at my school plugged a 24v power cable into a KVM which needed 12v, instant fry, smoke and all.


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## Zatharus

Eeeeesh...yeah...that will do it...


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## Cleric7x9

Tuffie said:


> No douche.



sigh you are a few posts too late


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## douche

Oh, well. Only Server boards usually have a socket 771, anyway.


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## Aastii

Cleric7x9 said:


> no douche



lmao at this, i thought that you were being an arse calling him a douche for asking what you think is an obvious question....i then noticed that the person asking was called douche


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## Zatharus

douche said:


> Oh, well. Only Server boards usually have a socket 771, anyway.



What are you trying to build?  You can technically get a Core 2 Quad Extreme for a 771 socket, but you will pay for it handsomely...well, you will pay handsomely for a Xeon too.


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## pfig88

douche said:


> Oh, well. Only Server boards usually have a socket 771, anyway.


Yeah, the only board i've got with the 771 sockets is my TYAN server motherboard, which has dual 771 sockets, and support for up to 128GB of RAM !!!


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## Cleric7x9

aastii said:


> lmao at this, i thought that you were being an arse calling him a douche for asking what you think is an obvious question....i then noticed that the person asking was called douche



   :d


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## douche

Zatharus said:


> What are you trying to build?  You can technically get a Core 2 Quad Extreme for a 771 socket, but you will pay for it handsomely...well, you will pay handsomely for a Xeon too.



A music server, and something that can broadcast internet radio, too. I almost fainted after seeing the price of that thing. How can a CPU cost $1,549??!!!


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## Aastii

douche said:


> A music server, and something that can broadcast internet radio, too. I almost fainted after seeing the price of that thing. How can a CPU cost $1,549??!!!



A HUNDRED AND FIFTY WATT PROCESSOR!?!? What the hell, that is a silly amount of power pull, i'd hope for something much less pricey too run if it is costing that much to buy in the first place


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## bomberboysk

douche said:


> A music server, and something that can broadcast internet radio, too. I almost fainted after seeing the price of that thing. How can a CPU cost $1,549??!!!



Almost fainted? Well... click this and you will faint
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819117176


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## douche

bomberboysk said:


> Almost fainted? Well... click this and you will faint
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...w much faster is that from a Q6600?:confused:


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## Zatharus

Like I said... Xeons are not cheap.  The ram for that motherboard won't be either.  I take it that the motherboard requires FB DIMMS?

And people wonder why the MacPros are expensive... It isn't just the Apple name.  


For a simple music server and something that will broadcast a 32-128kb/s internet radio stream, you could get an Atom based MSI wind micro computer for under $300 _with _RAM and a hard drive.  Seriously...are you just trying to use what you have lying around for a home project?  Or do you want to host a network stream for hundreds of thousands of listeners?  I'm just trying to gauge the scope of your project.


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## Zatharus

douche said:


> Well, at least it has dual cache for a total of  21 MB, is that right? But, still at 2.4 GHz & 1066 FSB, just how much faster is that from a Q6600?



Yes, that processor has a total of 21MB of cache between the L2 an L3 caches.  You are looking at a commercial/industrial, server grade processor.  This is not "consumer" level hardware.  The Xeon E7450 will crush the Q6600.  Did you notice that it is a 6-core processor as well?  In comparison the Q6600 is only a quad-core.  But, the differences in the archetecture don't stop there...


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## douche

Zatharus said:


> Did you notice that it is a 6-core processor as well?  In comparison the Q6600 is only a quad-core.  But, the differences in the archetecture don't stop there...



I almost forget about the *6* cores, too. What else makes this worth a whooping 2 grand??


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## Bodaggit23

Ok, so the answer to the OP is no.


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## just a noob

Zatharus said:


> Yes, that processor has a total of 21MB of cache between the L2 an L3 caches.  You are looking at a commercial/industrial, server grade processor.  This is not "consumer" level hardware.  The Xeon E7450 will crush the Q6600.  Did you notice that it is a 6-core processor as well?  In comparison the Q6600 is only a quad-core.  But, the differences in the archetecture don't stop there...



there's also quad socket motherboards out there(i think i'm thinking of the right chip) but the layout just kind of sucks on them, then i think you only get 2 pci-x slots with it for $1000, i just prefer the amd opteron's if i were to have a rendering machine(not really sure why else you need that many cores)


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## bomberboysk

just a noob said:


> there's also quad socket motherboards out there(i think i'm thinking of the right chip) but the layout just kind of sucks on them, then i think you only get 2 pci-x slots with it for $1000, i just prefer the amd opteron's if i were to have a rendering machine(not really sure why else you need that many cores)



One word- Folding


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## just a noob

nah, folding on gpu's is much more effiecient, for the same price as the quad socket boards, and processors(for the amd's its around 10K with ram and everything) you could have 6 rigs with 4 9800gx2's in them(you can pick them up for around $250), the k9a2(whatever its called, the one with four pcie slots), and an amd 7750 kuma


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## Zatharus

douche said:


> I almost forget about the *6* cores, too. What else makes this worth a whooping 2 grand??



Supply/demand and chip yields.  This is also Intel's premium product.   Why does a Mercedes-Benz SLR class vehicle cost more than a C-class vehicle?




Bodaggit23 said:


> Ok, so the answer to the OP is no.



Yes, that has been addressed already.


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## bomberboysk

just a noob said:


> nah, folding on gpu's is much more effiecient, for the same price as the quad socket boards, and processors(for the amd's its around 10K with ram and everything) you could have 6 rigs with 4 9800gx2's in them(you can pick them up for around $250), the k9a2(whatever its called, the one with four pcie slots), and an amd 7750 kuma



Yeah, im just stating one possible use of it, and for rendering anymore you can do the same thing on gpu's with cuda lol.


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## just a noob

touche lol, wonder what the purposes are on one of those then


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## Zatharus

just a noob said:


> touche lol, wonder what the purposes are on one of those then



Are you talking about the Xeon or the GPU?


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## just a noob

ye olde quad socket board with either xeon or opteron lol, like bomber pointed out, you could just use cuda on the gpu instead of the cpu's


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## douche

Zatharus said:


> Supply/demand and chip yields.  This is also Intel's premium product.   Why does a Mercedes-Benz SLR class vehicle cost more than a C-class vehicle?



What do you mean by "Supply/demand and chip yields"?

Also, regarding my music server, i'm NOT sure whether i want to "host a network stream for hundreds of thousands of listeners." But, suppose i do, how fast a CPU would that require? AFAIK, the speed of my wired/wireless NIC is more important, right?


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## just a noob

he means that intel only gets x amount of chips actually capable of running at those specifications, but they can't just slap the chips on a pcb and say its ready to go, they actually have to go through these chips(binning) to find the chips capable of running at the lowest voltage and heat output


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## Zatharus

douche said:


> What do you mean by "Supply/demand and chip yields"?
> 
> Also, regarding my music server, i'm NOT sure whether i want to "host a network stream for hundreds of thousands of listeners." But, suppose i do, how fast a CPU would that require? AFAIK, the speed of my wired/wireless NIC is more important, right?



Supply and demand in this case meaning:  Not as big of a market for these chips as for the Core 2/i7 chips which in turn means higher prices since less are made.  And, yes, like just a noob was saying, not all the chips that come off the fabricated wafer are actually usable.  They have to be tested and confirmed working at the desired speeds.  The Xeons are complex chips and with that much cache on the die, they are also very, very costly to produce in quantity because of the complexity.  High complexity usually means low yeilds.

Well, honestly, if you are contemplating that kind of a workload and audience, you will need a serious data pipeline and more than one server.  To get started, pick a Xeon (or two in your case) of any speed.  They will work.  You are looking at spending several thousand anyway right?


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## Bodaggit23

What exactly is the difference between an i7 920 and the Xeon X5550?

Besides the higher QPI, I don't see any difference for the price. At that
price, I'd rather have the 965 Extreme.


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## Zatharus

Bodaggit23 said:


> What exactly is the difference between an i7 920 and the Xeon X5550?
> 
> Besides the higher QPI, I don't see any difference for the price. At that
> price, I'd rather have the 965 Extreme.




In many ways they are the same.   The differences that break them apart are subtle but important:

1 - The i7 920 only has one QPI, thus only supporting a single processor per motherboard.  The Xeon X5550 has 2 QPIs, thus supporting two processors per motherboard.

2 - The Xeon has support for ECC memory.

3 - The thread balancing is slightly different for the Xeon and could give it a very slight advantage over the i7.

4 - If you look closely, the TDP for the Xeon is also lower (95W vs 130) and has a higher thermal spec (75C vs 68C).

EDIT:  As just a noob pointed out below, the Xeons also have a lower voltage range compared to the i7s (.75 - 1.35V vs .80 - 1.375V)


Essentially, the new Nehalem i7/Xeon lines are from the same mold.  The i7 was Intel's rush to get their new technology (integrated memory controller - well, new to their CPUs anyway).  In actual performance, you will see little difference.  In some ways, the i7 chips are not typical "consumer" chips.  That will probably fall to the i5 series (a true Core 2 replacement) whenever they ship.

The reason you are seeing the massive price difference is not only because of the differences mentioned above, but the Xeon chips are manufactured to much higher tolerances and only the cream of the crop make it out of the nursery (note point 4).  These chips are the industrial grade processors designed to function more efficiently and in harsher, more demanding environments.  They can take more punishment while still functioning at peak capacity - hence why they are commonly known as server grade processors.  This higher quality standard results in lower yeilds compared to the i7s as I mentioned before.  Not all the chips that come off the wafer are going to meet the stringent requirements to be a Xeon processor.


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## just a noob

binning and they are stable at much lower voltages
edit: zatharus, have you seen what the new xeon's clock to? i mean, i saw a w3520 at 4ghz with 1.1 volts or so


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## Zatharus

I'm not sure.  The new chips just came out on the general market.  They have been in MacPros for a while though.  I would expect a few OC articles/reviews to pop up in the next few weeks.

Ah, I forgot to mention the voltages.  Thank you for pointing that out.  I will edit the prior post to reflect that.


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## douche

Zatharus said:


> Well, honestly, if you are contemplating that kind of a workload and audience, you will need a serious data pipeline and more than one server.  To get started, pick a Xeon (or two in your case) of any speed.  They will work.  You are looking at spending several thousand anyway right?



Why would a need more than 1 server, and just how many would suffice? What about network card speed? How fast should the NIC(s) be?


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## Zatharus

douche said:


> Why would a need more than 1 server, and just how many would suffice? What about network card speed? How fast should the NIC(s) be?



This all depends on the traffic load you intend to cater to.  Just like any web-server that is feeding pages to those who request it, you will need to provide your media to those who need it.  The biggest difference between a simple web page server and a media server is that the typical aggregate data transfer rates are even higher per user.

The simplest way for you to setup an internet radio transmiter will be via a unicast transmission system.  If you really want to go big, you would be looking at multicast transmissions.  That is a whole different story.  The problem with unicast transmissions is that you need to provide the same feed to each user directly.  In other words, if you have a meager 32kb/s feed and you have four listenters, that means you are using up 32x4kb/s or 128kb/s of upload bandwidth.  This can add up very, very quickly.  On top of that, what if you start offering multiple streams?  See where I am going with this?

Aside from bandwidth considerations, the need for more servers is to balance the load out between multiple units.  This way, no one computer in a group gets overloaded with data requests.  They all share the data load.  Feeding network traffic, encoding the media stream or file retrieval will all tax a CPU.  Each CPU and storage system will have its limits.

You can start with a simple Pentium 1 setup on a tiny DSL line and go as large as a full blown data center on an OC192 pipe or two.  Just to help you get started, have a look over here.


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## douche

That link is very helpful, but i'm NOT sure if it's useful. That setup is VERY limiting. What's the difference between unicasting & multicasting? It looks like i'm stuck with Windows Media Encoder, Helix Server is only 12-months free, Live365 is expensive, and Shoutcast/Icecast only works with Winamp. Is there anything i can do about the delay? Does Windows Media Encoder support multicasting? How far past 5 users will WME allow? Where in the registry would i change it's setting? Looks like the author of that link even switched to MS Media Services, will that run on XP? Can it only support up to 90 users? I see now if i wanted to stream my radio across a city i would need about 6 Zeon servers on a SONET network, right?


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## Zatharus

Right, that link should give you an idea of where to start, just to experiment.  It is a very limited setup.  For large scale operations, you should look into some commercial products, or if you are adventurous, there are some open source Linux tools out there.  It has been quite a few years since I have done anything like this on Linux, but I can see about digging up some of my old resources.

Delay is inherent in all forms of data transmission.  The only way that you can reduce the amount of delay is to have an extremely fast/wide data pipe, the fastest processors you can find (for encoding and transmission), and end users with very fast internet access to your server.  Buffering of streaming media is normal.  The faster the connection is on both sides and the smaller the buffer, the less time is needed for buffering.  For example, a broadband user may pick up a 5-second buffer of your stream in under a second, but a dial-up user may need the full 5-seconds (or more) to fill out the buffer to prevent uninterrupted playback.

Most streaming applications can support multicasts if you have the appropriate setup.  Windows Media Encoder is one of those.  I am not sure how far past the initial 5 user limit you can configure WME for unicast, but in a multicast situation, you are essentially limitless.  WME will work on XP or even Vista.

The basic breakdown for Multicast vs Unicast is this:  Unicast is pretty much individual streams per user.  The server must feed out the stream to each requesting IP in a server to peer communication.  Multicast is more like a radio transmitter in that you have one stream going out and multiple users essentialy tuned in to that signal.  The end user points to the right IP and port and listens.  Each form has its own strengths and weaknesses.  For more detailed information, please head here for unicast and here for multicast.

As for the number of servers and the bandwidth you would need, that will depend highly upon the type of transmission and the form of service you wish to offer.  Fiber is one viable method of data transport, yes.

Edit:  Also, you may want to check out these guys.  Here is another good read over at TechRepublic.


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