# Is this Illegal?



## JamesBart (Apr 16, 2007)

i have a legit copy of windows that came with my dell computer last year and i would like to install it on a different computer.

is this legal to do or do i need to get a new copy? to me it seems illegal but any advice would be great guys. any similar experience?


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## apj101 (Apr 16, 2007)

it is illegal


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## JamesBart (Apr 16, 2007)

damn! going windows shopping now. thanks man 

also whats the best XP to get. i have SP2.


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## Geoff (Apr 16, 2007)

It wont work anyways, the Dell Windows CD checks to make sure your using a Dell motherboard that the CD was designed for.  If you try it in another PC, it wont let you install it.


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## JamesBart (Apr 16, 2007)

i see. so its specifically for a dell computer? so if im buying xp for a asus laptop will i have to get in contact with asus or will any windows work?

thanks


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## Shady (Apr 16, 2007)

Any windows will work.


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## Geoff (Apr 16, 2007)

If you buy either an OEM or Retail version of XP (or any Microsoft OS), from say Newegg, Bestbuy, etc, then you can install it on any type of PC you want, since it's not coded to only work with one manufacture.


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## lovely? (Apr 17, 2007)

yeah. omega's right. (whats new? lol) the only time i have been able to 'cheat' this was when i was allowed to use a dedicated D.O.D. key code. this computer was FOR the navy, so no it wasnt illegal...


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## chupacabra (Apr 17, 2007)

Buy an oem cuz the retail isn't worth the extra just for a nice box


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## INTELCRAZY (Apr 17, 2007)

chupacabra said:


> Buy an oem cuz the retail isn't worth the extra just for a nice box



You forgot about the manual that everyone must have, . OEM is the best, students get discounts .


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## JamesBart (Apr 18, 2007)

whats OEM and whats the best XP if there is one? thanks


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## Geoff (Apr 18, 2007)

6071842 said:


> whats OEM and whats the best XP if there is one? thanks



OEM = Original Equipment Manufacturer

Basically when you buy an OEM OS, all your getting is the operating system itself, and a quick start guide.  So you dont get the fancy box or the full instruction manual, but who needs that anyways?

The best version of XP would either be MCE or Pro.


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## JamesBart (Apr 18, 2007)

thanks man!  learn something new every day!


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## CPTMuller (Apr 18, 2007)

When you are installing windows you cant reuse a CD key from an unused computer? Or is that dell specific?


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## Jet (Apr 18, 2007)

6071842 said:


> thanks man!  learn something new every day!



XP Home isn't bad either, if you just want something to hold you over until Vista has Service Pack 128,940 out.


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## lovely? (Apr 18, 2007)

CPTMuller said:


> When you are installing windows you cant reuse a CD key from an unused computer? Or is that dell specific?



that is so illegal, and there are such deep-seated coding programs that check the cd-key for fraud, that even for a hacker, nowadays its almost impossible to reuse a cd-key, or make one up too


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## bumblebee_tuna (Apr 18, 2007)

From what I have heard, only the older, original Windows XP sans SP2 disc/key can be used on multiple computers, although, I'm still iffy on the legitimacy of that...........


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## Geoff (Apr 18, 2007)

bumblebee_tuna said:


> From what I have heard, only the older, original Windows XP sans SP2 disc/key can be used on multiple computers, although, I'm still iffy on the legitimacy of that...........


You can technically install XP or Vista on multiple machines with the same CD Key, but you can only activate them once.


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## apj101 (Apr 18, 2007)

> You can technically install XP or Vista on multiple machines with the same CD Key, but you can only activate them once.


just to add to that; even installing them would be an illegal act, remeber you get 30 days to activate  so you could be breaking the copyright for 30 days and then reinstall the OS hence never needing to pay...hence illegal


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## Geoff (Apr 18, 2007)

apj101 said:


> just to add to that; even installing them would be an illegal act, remeber you get 30 days to activate  so you could be breaking the copyright for 30 days and then reinstall the OS hence never needing to pay...hence illegal


I know, thats why I said _technically _you can install it, but as you said, it is illegal, and after 30 days woul would be out of luck.


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## JamesBart (Apr 18, 2007)

XP pro is expensive. haha it better be worth it


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## apj101 (Apr 18, 2007)

[-0MEGA-];639045 said:
			
		

> I know, thats why I said _technically _you can install it, but as you said, it is illegal, and after 30 days woul would be out of luck.



why are you getting defensive, i said i was adding to your point not contradicting it. 
Thats the second time you've gone defensive in as many days, on topics i was only adding to...


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## microchipper (Apr 18, 2007)

6071842 said:


> i have a legit copy of windows that came with my dell computer last year and i would like to install it on a different computer.
> 
> is this legal to do or do i need to get a new copy? to me it seems illegal but any advice would be great guys. any similar experience?



i may be wrong(usually am lol) but as long as the copy of windows is only used on any one pc at any one time then i always believed it to be legal.


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## Geoff (Apr 19, 2007)

apj101 said:


> why are you getting defensive, i said i was adding to your point not contradicting it.
> Thats the second time you've gone defensive in as many days, on topics i was only adding to...


Oh no, im not getting defensive or anything, I think my posts just make it seem like that.  I dont think i've ever actually meant to be defensive in any of my posts going back and forth with you ajp... lately


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## JamesBart (Apr 19, 2007)

microchipper said:


> i may be wrong(usually am lol) but as long as the copy of windows is only used on any one pc at any one time then i always believed it to be legal.



yeah i think you right! im begruding paying the money for a new OS. but £95 is alright


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## ETSA (Apr 19, 2007)

to the original poster, it is illegal, but is it immoral?


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## JamesBart (Apr 19, 2007)

ETSA said:


> to the original poster, it is illegal, but is it immoral?



well im thinking! once you've bought it once then it should be a problem to reuse it. shame i just bought me XP pro


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## subtle (Apr 19, 2007)

> once you've bought it once then it should be a problem to reuse it.


That is the truth with box. Not oem ver. Oem ver is assigned to mobo. So if something goes wrong and you need to replace the mobo - you need to replace the system as well.


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## Geoff (Apr 19, 2007)

subtle said:


> That is the truth with box. Not oem ver. Oem ver is assigned to mobo. So if something goes wrong and you need to replace the mobo - you need to replace the system as well.



Thats not true, OEM and Retail versions of XP are exactly the same.  You're probably thinking about the XP cd's that come with pre-built machines, such as Dell's.


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## subtle (Apr 19, 2007)

[-0MEGA-];639984 said:
			
		

> Thats not true, OEM and Retail versions of XP are exactly the same.  You're probably thinking about the XP cd's that come with pre-built machines, such as Dell's.



You're half-right.
They are not exactly the same. In oem ver you can not upgrade mobo. I was wrong saying that when mobo is dead you need to replace license as well. You can replace the mobo but it "must be the same make/model".


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## apj101 (Apr 19, 2007)

subtle said:


> You're half-right.
> They are not exactly the same. In oem ver you can not upgrade mobo. I was wrong saying that when mobo is dead you need to replace license as well. You can replace the mobo but it "must be the same make/model".



you can install an oem on any machine you like, if you upgrade the mobo it wont cause the OEM not to work ,you just may need to reactivate the installed version as microsoft will think you are trying to install the os on another machine.


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## Geoff (Apr 19, 2007)

subtle said:


> You're half-right.
> They are not exactly the same. In oem ver you can not upgrade mobo. I was wrong saying that when mobo is dead you need to replace license as well. You can replace the mobo but it "must be the same make/model".



No, thats not right either.

OEM and Retail CD's are exactly the same.  The only difference is that OEM doesnt include the box or full manual, only the CD and quick star guide.

With both OEM and Retail, you can re-install Windows once more on any PC and activate it.  After that one time you will have to call Microsoft to get a new activation key.

You can use the OEM version and replace motherboards.


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## subtle (Apr 19, 2007)

I found this:
"In general, OEM software may not be transferred from one system to another system.  However, the computer system can certainly be updated with new components without the requirement of a new software license.  The only exception to this is the motherboard."

"Quoted from MS System Builders

"If the motherboard is replaced because it is defective, you do NOT need to acquire a new operating system license for the PC. The replacement motherboard must be the same make/model or the same manufacturer’s replacement/equivalent.""

But they might be wrong...


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## Geoff (Apr 19, 2007)

You and them are confusing the term "OEM".  They are using the term OEM as the version of Windows that came with their PC, meaning that you cant use your OEM Dell Windows XP CD on another system.

But OEM versions direct from Microsoft arent made for a specific motherboard, so they can be used on any machine.


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## subtle (Apr 19, 2007)

As far as I know the oem from M$ is assigned to a mobo when it is installed/activated on a particular computer.
Don't you think it'll be a little bit silly to charge £200 for a book and a box?


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## Geoff (Apr 19, 2007)

subtle said:


> As far as I know the oem from M$ is assigned to a mobo when it is installed/activated on a particular computer.
> Don't you think it'll be a little bit silly to charge £200 for a book and a box?


It's not though, when you buy an OEM version of Windows from say, Newegg, you install it on your brand new PC, activate it, and then its working.  You then sell that PC and buy a new PC, you can install it, but you may have to call Microsoft to get a new activation key since it's already been activated once, but you need to do that on retail versions as well.

Windows doesnt assign your copy of Windows with a particular motherboard.


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## Cromewell (Apr 19, 2007)

Take it from someone who has called Microsoft to activate the same windows XP OEM version key (ie. the nonboxed version) numerous times, they don't care if you change motherboards, only if you are trying to use the key on more than 1 machine at the same time.


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## subtle (Apr 20, 2007)

I just phoned M$ and... I'm right.


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## apj101 (Apr 20, 2007)

subtle said:


> I just phoned M$ and... I'm right.



jesus, stop being so stubborn. you're not right. You probably didn't ask the question right to m$, or the monkey on the other end just had no idea what you meant
I will bet you every penny i can ever earn that an OEM version is not tied to a mobo


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## bumblebee_tuna (Apr 20, 2007)

I must have some cracked key or something because I was able to activate the XP Pro I borrowed fom my neighbor with no problems.

*Edited*
From first hand experience, I'd like to reiteriate that the OS on prefab machines are different; you can tell just by opening up the system information window.  (You'll usually see the company's logo at the bottom.)  When I blew out and replaced my mobo with a different one, I was unable to load XP and barely was able to go into safemode due to that it saw it as corrupt data, or something to the equivilent.  They're just trying to get around saying you need a new license as long as you buy their over-priced, modified products.

Thinking about it, I doubt it would be cracked because I think he is very legit when it comes to computers because he works for a big computer company; cnet.  I venture to bet that it's the very first original version of XP Pro without any updates.  Weird thing though, that it will only format 128GB of disk space when you load it.


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## subtle (Apr 20, 2007)

I'm not being stubborn. I just know that I'm right. On different forum where they have Microsoft Expert, questions like that were asked many times.

Try and call M$ (if you want):
0870 60 10 100

..or maybe indeed she didn't understood what I meant.

Lets just close this discussion. What you say?


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## Cromewell (Apr 20, 2007)

> I just phoned M$ and... I'm right.


Are you sure we are talking about the same type of OEM copy? I'm talking about the kind that doesn't come in a box with a fancy design and documentation and stuff, not the kind that companies like Dell ship out on a Dell stamped OS cd.

All I do is call them up, a minute later when I actually get to talk to someone they ask me what my problem is, I tell them I'm trying to activate windows and it told me to call this number. They ask if I've installed the copy of windows on other machines, which, of course I haven't, then they ask how I've used up the activations to which I answer I changed the motherboard. They say OK and give me a code to enter and it's all done in about 2 minutes including the minute it took for me to get to them


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## bumblebee_tuna (Apr 20, 2007)

My question now is how I'm able to use my neighbor's CD with the same key?  Because I have also used the same Key on other computers too (just as a reformat....) and I haven't had any validation problems.


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## shawn_selig29 (Apr 20, 2007)

i like the oem disks... as where i run all dells... they run on all computers.. especially with there own keys....makes it easier instead of having a million and one cd's...


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## JamesBart (Apr 23, 2007)

is this the full xp home sp2 OEM disc? or is it just an upgrade? i know this may seem like a stupid question but i have seen what im looking for at the price of like 160 pounds.

here it is...

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=OS-001-MS&groupid=33&catid=20&subcat=

thanks


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## Geoff (Apr 24, 2007)

subtle said:


> I just phoned M$ and... I'm right.





subtle said:


> I'm not being stubborn. I just know that I'm right. On different forum where they have Microsoft Expert, questions like that were asked many times.
> 
> Try and call M$ (if you want):
> 0870 60 10 100
> ...


Ok dude.  You are not right.

You are talking about the OEM versions that come with pre-built PC's such as Dell's, HP's, Acer's, etc.  The OEM versions that you buy from places such as Newegg or Tiger Direct are OEM, but they are direct from Microsoft.  Meaning that it's directly from Microsoft but only with the disc, none of the fancy packaging or extensive documentation.

You can install either the Retail or OEM versions of Windows XP on any computer you wish, regardless of motherboard manufacturer.  However legally, you can only use it on one PC at a time.  If you sell the PC or do major upgrades, you can re-install Windows on that machine, it does not "attach itself" to the motherboard brand you had before.  You simply call up Microsoft, tell them the story, and they will give you a new activation key.


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## microchipper (Apr 24, 2007)

*as far as i'm concerned*



			
				[-0MEGA-];644142 said:
			
		

> Ok dude.  You are not right.
> 
> You are talking about the OEM versions that come with pre-built PC's such as Dell's, HP's, Acer's, etc.  The OEM versions that you buy from places such as Newegg or Tiger Direct are OEM, but they are direct from Microsoft.  Meaning that it's directly from Microsoft but only with the disc, none of the fancy packaging or extensive documentation.
> 
> You can install either the Retail or OEM versions of Windows XP on any computer you wish, regardless of motherboard manufacturer.  However legally, you can only use it on one PC at a time.  If you sell the PC or do major upgrades, you can re-install Windows on that machine, it does not "attach itself" to the motherboard brand you had before.  You simply call up Microsoft, tell them the story, and they will give you a new activation key.


I have had both OEM and full retail versions of XP and have NEVER had any trouble installing them on my machines over and over again after mobo changes,hard drive changes, etc etc. The worst thing that happens is either it will ask me to re-activate my version within 3 days(due to hardware change) or iget the "please contact microsoft" message with phone number.

     Whenever i ring they didn't even question my mobo change(which aparrently they only approve if faulty) and gave me a new code.

     M$ are only REALLY concerned with piracy and as long as you can prove to their satisfaction you aint installing one copy on loads of machines or something silly, then they will usually help you all they can. 

     XP is XP(with the obvious difference of home/professional) and as long as you only install ONE copy on any ONE machine at a time(home users) then their should be no problem.


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## JamesBart (Apr 24, 2007)

cheap legit unopened versions on ebay people! why'd it take me so long to think of it?

thanks guys


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## microchipper (May 12, 2007)

JamesBart said:


> cheap legit unopened versions on ebay people! why'd it take me so long to think of it?
> 
> thanks guys



just make sure they come with the product key sticker !!! that is after all what you are really paying for.


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## zaroba (May 12, 2007)

microchipper said:


> Whenever i ring they didn't even question my mobo change(which aparrently they only approve if faulty) and gave me a new code.
> 
> M$ are only REALLY concerned with piracy and as long as you can prove to their satisfaction you aint installing one copy on loads of machines or something silly, then they will usually help you all they can.




keep in mind that just because its a money hungry coorperation doesen't mean they have employees that love and worship there job.  any people that consumers can interact with are people just like you and me, people who probably hate the company they work for and don't don't care too much for there dead end job where they listen to idiots all day.

so yea, it woulden't be too hard to get new keys etc from them, even if you lied about it.






subtle said:


> On different forum where they have Microsoft Expert, questions like that were asked many times.


first of all, what defines him as being an 'expert'?  is it just because he went threw tsome microsoft certification course?  believe it or not experts often don't know correct info, especially if they get an ego about being an expert.  you can go threw any type of microsoft certification course to become a microsoft certified windows technicion.  however, these courses are complete junk.  if you learn windows from years of use and trial and error, you will learn completly different and faster ways to do things, completly different and more logical solutions to problems, and even see that some things don't even act the way the course says they do.

why?  because when you go threw a certification course, microsoft wants you to learn to do things *there* way.


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## JamesBart (May 12, 2007)

microchipper said:


> just make sure they come with the product key sticker !!! that is after all what you are really paying for.



nice little thing to point out! cheers man


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## microchipper (May 12, 2007)

zaroba said:


> keep in mind that just because its a money hungry coorperation doesen't mean they have employees that love and worship there job.  any people that consumers can interact with are people just like you and me, people who probably hate the company they work for and don't don't care too much for there dead end job where they listen to idiots all day.
> 
> so yea, it woulden't be too hard to get new keys etc from them, even if you lied about it.
> 
> ...



you sound very bitter on this subject.... had a bad experience have we.??

oh and it's *their* way , by the way


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## subtle (May 12, 2007)

> however, these courses are complete junk. if you learn windows from years of use and trial and error, you will learn completly different and faster ways to do things, completly different and more logical solutions to problems, and even see that some things don't even act the way the course says they do.
> 
> why? because when you go threw a certification course, microsoft wants you to learn to do things *there* way.



I understand that you did some of their courses?


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## DrCuddles (May 12, 2007)

zaroba said:


> However, these courses are complete junk.  if you learn windows from years of use and trial and error, you will learn completly different and faster ways to do things, completly different and more logical solutions to problems, and even see that some things don't even act the way the course says they do.
> 
> why?  because when you go threw a certification course, microsoft wants you to learn to do things *there* way.



My dad has done one of these courses, He is a Microsoft Certified Partner, its funny, he said that he started doing it their way and after about 10 minutes gave up and did it his way that he had been doing for years and said it wias twice as fast his way, Microsoft are noobs


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## subtle (May 12, 2007)

DrCuddles said:


> My dad has done one of these courses, He is a Microsoft Certified Partner, its funny, he said that he started doing it their way and after about 10 minutes gave up and did it his way that he had been doing for years and said it wias twice as fast his way, Microsoft are noobs



Yes. That's true. For them there is Microsoft way and only Microsoft way.

EDIT:
Plus if your dad has years of experience in doing stuff I'm not surprised that it took him less time by doing it his way (since he knew the way-opposite to the M$ way he just learned).


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## INTELCRAZY (May 12, 2007)

I have XP Home SP2 on my older rig, could I use the OEM copy of it to install on my new PC? My old rig will be terminated, I hopefully will be dual booting with Vista.


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## subtle (May 12, 2007)

As long as it is not installed on your old comp and it's Microsoft OEM not Dell or something.


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## DrCuddles (May 12, 2007)

subtle said:


> Yes. That's true. For them there is Microsoft way and only Microsoft way.
> 
> EDIT:
> Plus if your dad has years of experience in doing stuff I'm not surprised that it took him less time by doing it his way (since he knew the way-opposite to the M$ way he just learned).



Yes  He is amazing at IT, dont think he knows as much as it seems but he knows every shortcut in virtually every program he uses and just flys through everything, its wierd watching him


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## INTELCRAZY (May 12, 2007)

subtle said:


> As long as it is not installed on your old comp and it's Microsoft OEM not Dell or something.



Okay, I have thought about that with the Dell CD, lol. Even though it wouldn't work due to mobo manufacturer.


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## JamesBart (May 14, 2007)

another question i have is...

are used oem illegal? cos you can buy em. and if so how would it work?

http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/tg/detail/offer-listing/-/B000JTDV6M/new

Thanks


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## JlCollins005 (May 14, 2007)

u can use dell windows disc on ne pc and it will install, but will not activate


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## JamesBart (May 14, 2007)

yeah i know that 

the question i have is can i buy a used oem and that still be legal? seems a bit funny. check the link on my last post for it 

Thanks


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## subtle (May 14, 2007)

I'd say no but everyone is saying that it is... so I don't really know...


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## JamesBart (May 14, 2007)

i think im going to buy a whole new version! thats what i'll do! i never actaully got round to it when i said i did so now im going to buy it!  thanks guys


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## JamesBart (May 14, 2007)

found it cheap also


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## garethcia (May 15, 2007)

please note you can install the dell cd's on any computer i have installed xp on many computers from dell it works fine.

you just need an activation key


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## X2BreakOfFate (May 28, 2007)

um lol yes you can use a dell cd on different computers. its just the operating system in backup form so you dont have to enter a cd key.


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