# Directx10



## Instinct5 (Feb 23, 2008)

my vid card is dx10 compatible and i was wondering how it worked and how i get it cause its still showing i have dx9.0c so i was wondering if it was like something u download or if its something that comes with ur vid card driver disc?


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## PC eye (Feb 23, 2008)

Vista comes with DX10 included but will also run DX9. The video card itself while being DX10 compatible is not a strictly DX10 required card to see the full implementation of 10 still being a DX9 card in most ways. The current games out are still DX9 based until newer ones requiring Vista and DX10 come out.


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## Instinct5 (Feb 23, 2008)

ah so it only needs dx10 for certain games and when i play those it will tell me i need that right?


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## Smashkirby (Feb 23, 2008)

Yes, some games are in DX9, some in DX10. Others like Crysis allow you to play in either. Since your GPU can display DX10, if you're playing a DX10 game it will display it.


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## PC eye (Feb 23, 2008)

Once you get into something no longer XP/DX9 compatible requiring SX10 then the Direct X tool will obviously display 10. XP by itself didn't come with 9c but saw an upgrade to it by separately being downloaded whether by updates or manually going to MS to see it downloaded direct.


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## Geoff (Feb 23, 2008)

Are you running XP or Vista?

DX10 is only available for Vista.


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## Archangel (Feb 23, 2008)

yea, what omega said.     damn pc_eye, why didnt you put it just that simple?


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## Geoff (Feb 23, 2008)

Archangel said:


> yea, what omega said.     damn pc_eye, why didnt you put it just that simple?



hehe, I just cut right to the chase


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## Instinct5 (Feb 23, 2008)

i have vista home premium


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## Geoff (Feb 23, 2008)

Since you have Vista, I'm a little confused here.  What does DXDIAG say you have for a DirectX version?  It should say DirectX 10.


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## Instinct5 (Feb 23, 2008)

it says i have directx 9.0c thats why im asking lol cause i figured it should be dx10


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## PC eye (Feb 24, 2008)

Even with Vista coming with 10 included you are still mainly running in the DX9 framework until getting into DX10 games as well as DX10 required model cards. All that will be a wait to see however since even newer games will likely be XP/DX9 compatible still. In fact I run some old 98/ME/2000 games on Vista with 9c installed as well.


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## Geoff (Feb 24, 2008)

PC eye said:


> Even with Vista coming with 10 included you are still mainly running in the DX9 framework until getting into DX10 games as well as DX10 required model cards. All that will be a wait to see however since even newer games will likely be XP/DX9 compatible still. In fact I run some old 98/ME/2000 games on Vista with 9c installed as well.


That wouldn't matter, DXDIAG should still say he had DirectX 10.


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## PC eye (Feb 25, 2008)

Not if a bad install of Windows was seen. The software installer for the video card likely saw 9 go on while something was lost when Vista was installed. Once the dxdiag command was used it reported what is lacking. Until a reinstallation is performed you will be limited to 9c there.


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## Archangel (Feb 25, 2008)

you could always try and just download DX10 from the microsoft website I suppose 

http://www.gamesforwindows.com/en-US/AboutGFW/Pages/directx10-a.aspx


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## PC eye (Feb 25, 2008)

Archangel said:


> you could always try and just download DX10 from the microsoft website I suppose
> 
> http://www.gamesforwindows.com/en-US/AboutGFW/Pages/directx10-a.aspx


 
 Which would be a waste of time since DX10 is not available separately from Vista like previously releases.

*DirectX End-User Runtime Web Installer 

*

*Brief Description*

November 2007
The Microsoft DirectX® End-User Runtime provides updates to 9.0c and previous versions of DirectX — the core Windows® technology that drives high-speed multimedia and games on the PC.
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/...38-DB71-4C1B-BC6A-9B6652CD92A3&displaylang=en

When running XP or older versions that saw 8.1 or none you then had to go to MS directly to download the latest version seen.


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## Instinct5 (Feb 25, 2008)

so how can i fix this? Download DX10 from website or wait till a game thats DX10 Detects it?


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## Archangel (Feb 25, 2008)

try the download from the website.    I mean it says it has DX9.0c atm, so trying it wouldnt hurt


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## PC eye (Feb 26, 2008)

DX10 isn't available separately like seen with 9c and older versions. It's new in Vista only being built into the new version. If the drivers for 10 were knocked out you two options of either seeing a system restore to bring the system back where you can or see Windows reinstalled all over again.

This is one thing many complain when looking at Vista and seeing 10 and other things now built into the version and not simply optional with either a separate update or the add/remove Windows components option from 98 to XP for the most part. Supposedly the other separate 9L will be a version of 10 for XP. When?


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## Geoff (Feb 26, 2008)

Can you take a screenshot of what DXDIAG shows for you?


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## PC eye (Feb 26, 2008)

If you need a program for screen captures an excellent one is Faststone found at  http://www.pcworld.com/downloads/file/fid,64857-page,1-c,downloads/description.html

You have that set to load up along with Windows but minimized to the Start taskbar and simply press the prtscrn button for the full desktop or use the crtl-shift-prtscrn combo to freehand trace around the dx tool.


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## Geoff (Feb 26, 2008)

PC eye said:


> If you need a program for screen captures an excellent one is Faststone found at  http://www.pcworld.com/downloads/file/fid,64857-page,1-c,downloads/description.html
> 
> You have that set to load up along with Windows but minimized to the Start taskbar and simply press the prtscrn button for the full desktop or use the crtl-shift-prtscrn combo to freehand trace around the dx tool.



Or just press the Prt Scr button and press CTRL+V in Paint...


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## PC eye (Feb 27, 2008)

[-0MEGA-];908191 said:
			
		

> Or just press the Prt Scr button and press CTRL+V in Paint...


 
With the tool there you can designate any folder for repeat saves without chasing through the documents folders under your user name. Plus you can capture active windows as well as hand trace around a certail area of the screen not just trying to look at the entire desktop only. 

Having worked with this one for some time now it actually does about the best job since you can also enlarge a capture and capture again when opening one up to view it. That brings things up even closer.


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## Instinct5 (Feb 27, 2008)

I did the download off the website and it says directx10 now  thank you for the help guys


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## AcetheGamer (Feb 27, 2008)

So you downloaded directX 10? from what website?


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## tlarkin (Feb 27, 2008)

Wow, no I think that the game itself has to support DX10, and by default vista ships with DX10 so its installed.  If the game does not support DX10, then when you look into properties it runs in a compatibility mode of DX9.0c instead.


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## PC eye (Feb 27, 2008)

Apparently the dxsetup.exe downloaded the correction needed once it detected Vista. But 10 itself is not available as a separate download you can save to some folder. The web installer simply repaired what was knocked out or never put on which works out for you rather then finding that a reinstall of Windows was going to be needed.

Now if you could repair Vista in general like when seeing IE 7 knocked out and not having restore points available that would be something. Online automatic OS repair!


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## Instinct5 (Feb 27, 2008)

lol thank god for the internet haha


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## tlarkin (Feb 27, 2008)

Instinct5 said:


> lol thank god for the internet haha



by god do you mean Al Gore?


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## PC eye (Feb 27, 2008)

tlarkin said:


> by god do you mean Al Gore?


 
That's staying on topic!  {note please redirect any political discussion to the appropiate whatever?}


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## tlarkin (Feb 27, 2008)

This thread is well, totally misinformed to begin with and I was being Ironic.  Anyway, unless you actually went in and uninstall the widnows component DX10, it wouldn't revert back to DX9, how or why would it?  The user in the post was probably playing a game that ran in both modes and had it flagged for DX 9 for some reason.  That seems to be the most common problem from what I have read about it, and I was making a deductive educated guess.  I don't see how Windows would just up and uninstall DX10 (though I have seen windows do some really strange things).


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## PC eye (Feb 27, 2008)

With 9c on from some game's installer it wouldn't take much for something like that. The dxdiag is an old tool at this point for a new OS with a proprietary nature on things. While readily seeing 10 listed in a default Vista circumstance something could have simply made the 10 drivers inactive where those for 9 were simply picked up there.


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## tlarkin (Feb 27, 2008)

DX is not a set of drivers, its an API, which is in the OS and most likely was not uninstalled by anything.  I almost want to bet money on my theory it makes the most logical sense.


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## PC eye (Feb 27, 2008)

Obviously you have the Runtime and SDK seen there with libraries. You could say the same about the catalyst control center being a bridge between hardware and software as well seeing a new app to go with a new set of drivers with each version.

Apparently MS changed the rules as I thought where while 10 is not a separate download you can still see it go onto any Vista system most like through the auto detection of the new version.  http://www.gamesforwindows.com/en-US/AboutGFW/Pages/directx10-a.aspx


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## Praetor (Mar 27, 2008)

Instinct5 said:
			
		

> my vid card is dx10 compatible


Interpreting that is contextual. From a *hardware* perspective, if you have a fairly recent video card (any of the GeForce8, GeForce9 cards, all the Ati 3000-series cards and I think all but the very bottom bin ATi 2000-series cards ) then those are what we would call "DirectX10 cards". In this context, it means that the card is physically capable of executing a "DirectX10 instruction".

Another perspective, taking the word "compatible" literally, it could just mean that the card wont/shouldnt fail if DirectX10 is installed. This is often used as a marketing gimmic (i.e you'll see, say, a GeForce 7300 -- which cannot physically execute 'directx10 instructions', market itself as 'directx10 compatible' -- which is true -- the card will function fine with directx10 -- it will just be limited to the directx9 instruction set).

If you tell us the card, we can help directly answer your question. (*Looks at sig*, it's a DirectX10 hardware card).




			
				PC Eye said:
			
		

> The video card itself while being DX10 compatible is not a strictly DX10 required card to see the full implementation of 10 still being a DX9 card in most ways. The current games out are still DX9 based until newer ones requiring Vista and DX10 come out.


That's difficult to read at best and slightly wrong at worst. If I interpret correctly, directx10, in it's "full" implementation, is significantly one up from directx9 (9c even). As we're talking about graphics, I presume you're limiting this to D3D really. It just happens to be that, at the time of launch, there were not many DirectX10 titles our and those that were out were not revolutionary.

As for the last bit, that's incorrect. Hellgate London (current game), is a DirectX10 game. As is Crysis. Both 2007 games and implementing DirectX10 instructions (for better or worse).




			
				Instinct5 said:
			
		

> ah so it only needs dx10 for certain games and when i play those it will tell me i need that right?


At this point, no game "needs" Dx10. Ignoring any XP-hacks, if you have all the prerequisites (i.e DirectX10 game, DirectX10 HARDWARE-capable videocard, see above, Vista) then you can opt to run it in DirectX10 mode. Otherwise, if the game has been developed decently well, DirectX10 wont even be an option and forcing it will cause it to crash or pop up a message indicating the missing pre-requisite (dependant on game).




			
				smashkirby said:
			
		

> some in DX10


What games are DirectX10 only? (short of Dev samples of course)




			
				PC Eye said:
			
		

> Even with Vista coming with 10 included you are still mainly running in the DX9 framework until getting into DX10 games as well as DX10 required model cards. All that will be a wait to see however since even newer games will likely be XP/DX9 compatible still. In fact I run some old 98/ME/2000 games on Vista with 9c installed as well.





			
				PC Eye said:
			
		

> Once you get into something no longer XP/DX9 compatible requiring SX10 then the Direct X tool will obviously display 10. XP by itself didn't come with 9c but saw an upgrade to it by separately being downloaded whether by updates or manually going to MS to see it downloaded direct.


That is so horribly incorrect (moreso the second quote although if I took the time, I could pick holes through the first). The DWM generally executes in D3D9 mode (DWM is, for all intents and purposes, the windows environment). Regardless of this fact, DXDIAG reports DX10 when the hardware/OS prerequisites are met. Failing that, there is a problem.



			
				PC Eye said:
			
		

> Not if a bad install of Windows was seen. The software installer for the video card likely saw 9 go on while something was lost when Vista was installed. Once the dxdiag command was used it reported what is lacking. Until a reinstallation is performed you will be limited to 9c there.


DirectX10 was released Nov 30, 2007.  The first G80 cards to be released came out mid-2007. However, the G92 was released Oct 29, 2007. Do you mean to suggest that, even though the G80 cards who's drivers work fine for DX10, for some reason, because the G92 was launched a mere month before DX10 was RTM'd, that the driver team just "forgot" and set a magical flag to DX9? 



			
				Archangel said:
			
		

> try the download from the website. I mean it says it has DX9.0c atm, so trying it wouldnt hurt





			
				PC eye said:
			
		

> Which would be a waste of time since DX10 is not available separately from Vista like previously releases.


Actually, you *can*. Sure that looks like DX9. Hell even the dsetup.dll has the signature 4.9.0.0904 which is DX9. But PCEye, if the entire package is DX9 only as you suggest, can you please explain the presence of these cab files:

 NOV2007_d3dx10_36_x64.cab
 NOV2007_d3dx10_36_x86.cab
 APR2007_d3dx10_33_x64.cab
 APR2007_d3dx10_33_x86.cab
 AUG2007_d3dx10_35_x64.cab
 AUG2007_d3dx10_35_x86.cab
 DEC2006_d3dx10_00_x64.cab
 DEC2006_d3dx10_00_x86.cab
 JUN2007_d3dx10_34_x64.cab
 JUN2007_d3dx10_34_x86.cab
 Mar2008_d3dx10_37_x64.cab
 Mar2008_d3dx10_37_x86.cab




			
				acethegamer said:
			
		

> So you downloaded directX 10? from what website?


Go *here*




			
				PC Eye said:
			
		

> But 10 itself is not available as a separate download you can save to some folder


Depends on how you define "itself". Sure one can argue that you cant download DirectX10 and try and install it on XP and get it to register DirectX10. But to say it's not entirely available would be incorrect. Downloading the current DirectX redist will save DX10 there. Since the DX10 portion can only be registered (i'll refrain from using the word 'installed') on Vista machines, which already have a DX10 stub if you will, it's a moot point. For anyone where DX10 would be a viable scenario, the latest DirectX9/DirectX10 is arguably available online.




			
				tlarkin said:
			
		

> The user in the post was probably playing a game that ran in both modes and had it flagged for DX 9 for some reason.


Quite insightful. Another possibility is that there could be multiple executable (i.e. Crysis, Hellgate), one for DX9, one for DX10 with it defaulting to DX9 (safer route) until settings said otherwise.




			
				PC Eye said:
			
		

> With 9c on from some game's installer it wouldn't take much for something like that


Given the cab file breakdown I mentioned earlier, and the likelihood that the "directx installer" is, in fact, such a redist (like its supposed to be), DX10 would be stubbed on (and again see my comments about viable impact on DX10 users)




			
				PC Eye said:
			
		

> The dxdiag is an old tool at this point for a new OS with a proprietary nature on things


Or you just made a mistake. DirectX, for all intents and purposes, is a bunch of dlls. Dlls have version numbers tagged into them in, well, standard places. DXDIAG is just a gui to query such information (and more).




			
				tlarkin said:
			
		

> DX is not a set of drivers, its an API, which is in the OS and most likely was not uninstalled by anything. I almost want to bet money on my theory it makes the most logical sense.


Absolutely. This is very likely a third-party coding messup (although doesnt really affect anything substaintial)




			
				PC Eye said:
			
		

> You could say the same about the catalyst control center being a bridge between hardware and software as well seeing a new app to go with a new set of drivers with each version


Actually you cant. To say so would be a grave mistake. The Catalyst Control Panel (or nVidia's Panel for that matter) is a go-between for the *driver*. The driver is the bridge between software and hardware you speak of.




			
				PC Eye said:
			
		

> Apparently MS changed the rules as I thought where while 10 is not a separate download you can still see it go onto any Vista system most like through the auto detection of the new version


My point still stands


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## Geoff (Mar 28, 2008)

Welcome back Praetor


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## Okedokey (Mar 30, 2008)

All hail king know it all.


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## PC eye (Mar 30, 2008)

If I need a definition out of a dicationary I'll simply post it.

*DirectX*

*From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia*


Jump to: navigation, search



It has been suggested that _DxDiag_ be merged into this article or section. (Discuss)DirectX

Developed byMicrosoftLatest release10.1 / 4 February 2008OSMicrosoft WindowsGenreApplication frameworkLicenseProprietary EULAWebsiteDirectX Homepage*Microsoft DirectX* is a collection of application programming interfaces (APIs) for handling tasks related to multimedia, especially game programming and video, on Microsoft platforms. Originally, the names of these APIs all began with Direct, such as Direct3D, DirectDraw, DirectMusic, DirectPlay, DirectSound, and so forth. DirectX, then, was the generic term for all of these Direct-something APIs, and that term became the name of the collection. Over the intervening years, some of these APIs have been deprecated and replaced, so that this naming convention is no longer absolute. In fact, the X has caught on to the point that it has replaced Direct as the common part in the names of new DirectX technologies, including XAct, XInput, and so forth. Additionally, when Microsoft decided to develop game consoles based on DirectX, the X stuck, leading to the name Xbox (and later Xbox 360).
Direct3D (the 3D graphics API within DirectX) is widely used in the development of computer games for Microsoft Windows, Microsoft Xbox, and Microsoft Xbox 360. Direct3D is also used by other software applications for visualization and graphics tasks, most notably among the engineering sector for CAD/CAM, because of its ability to quickly render high-quality 3D graphics using DirectX-compatible graphics hardware. As Direct3D is the most widely recognized API in DirectX, it is common to see the name DirectX used in place of Direct3D.
The interfaces that comprise DirectX include components for use by a running application (runtime components) as well as components for use by software developers at design time (the software development kit). The runtimes were originally redistributed by computer game developers along with their games, but are now included as built-in parts of Microsoft Windows. The SDK is available as a free download. While the runtimes are proprietary, closed-source software, source code is provided for most of the SDK samples.
The latest versions of Direct3D, namely, Direct3D 10 and Direct3D 9Ex, are exclusive to Windows Vista. This is because there were extensive changes in the Windows graphics architecture, and in particular the introduction of the Windows Display Driver Model. This redesign of the graphics infrastructure for Windows Vista supports virtualizing graphics hardware to multiple applications and services such as the Desktop Window Manager, in contrast to the exclusive access afforded to DirectX applications on Windows XP. Both Direct3D 9Ex and Direct3D 10 rely on the WDDM infrastructure and WDDM drivers.


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## diduknowthat (Mar 31, 2008)

OMG IT's PRAETOR!! *bookmarks page*.


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## PC eye (Mar 31, 2008)

diduknowthat said:


> OMG IT's PRAETOR!! *bookmarks page*.


 
You'll have to! It's like a UFO sighting where one minute you see him and then.... "where did he go?  "


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## Praetor (Apr 2, 2008)

PC Eye, I fail to see how the (wiki i presume) exerpt of DirectX addresses anything I said (unless, of course, you we'rent replying to me)




> You'll have to! It's like a UFO sighting where one minute you see him and then.... "where did he go?


Hehe ya well.


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## Okedokey (Apr 3, 2008)

Praetor im new, but, are you always such a nob?  All the postings ive see from you have been condesending, and very unfriendly.  Please excuse me and accept my apology if ive missed something, but really, do you think that everyone else has nothing to offer?

From what i have seen, PC Eye has tried to help the OP as best he can, now he may not be Bill Praetor Gates, but hes trying.  Isn't that what you want in a forum?

Now im not privy to all the conversations that are going  on in the "staff room", but im sure there is no need for such an unwelcoming tone and manner.  Please correct me where you will, as i am sure you will.


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## Geoff (Apr 3, 2008)

bigfellla said:


> Praetor im new, but, are you always such a nob?  All the postings ive see from you have been condesending, and very unfriendly.  Please excuse me and accept my apology if ive missed something, but really, do you think that everyone else has nothing to offer?
> 
> From what i have seen, PC Eye has tried to help the OP as best he can, now he may not be Bill Praetor Gates, but hes trying.  Isn't that what you want in a forum?
> 
> Now im not privy to all the conversations that are going  on in the "staff room", but im sure there is no need for such an unwelcoming tone and manner.  Please correct me where you will, as i am sure you will.


You really don't know who you are talking to.  If someone can't handle being shut down, then maybe they shouldn't be posting incorrect information.

Praetor is an extremely knowledgeable member, and has been very helpful in every topic he posts in.


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## Okedokey (Apr 3, 2008)

its not about his knowledge, i never bought that into question.

being "shut down", is antisocial, and if that is how this forum works, than fine.  I am just saying it is not exactly friendly.


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## PC eye (Apr 3, 2008)

[-0MEGA-];940862 said:
			
		

> You really don't know who you are talking to. If someone can't handle being shut down, then maybe they shouldn't be posting incorrect information.


 
What's incorrect about...?  Direct3D (Microsoft) This API has become fairly common now, but it is not well-loved by programmers because of it’s finicky, chipset-dependent nature. Most 3D games released have D3D support.

Praetor is an extremely knowledgeable member, and has been very helpful in every topic he posts in.[/quote]

You mean you finally figured that out? He's one of the best here at CF to start with!  

His stickies could use a little updating of course. But gee? The last time seen was in May 2007? Another rare Praetor sighting I guess!  "he's back!"


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## Geoff (Apr 3, 2008)

PC eye said:


> What's incorrect about...?  Direct3D (Microsoft) This API has become fairly common now, but it is not well-loved by programmers because of it’s finicky, chipset-dependent nature. Most 3D games released have D3D support.
> 
> Praetor is an extremely knowledgeable member, and has been very helpful in every topic he posts in.
> 
> ...


I was referring to people posting incorrect information in general, I wasn't saying that your post was or wasn't correct.


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## PC eye (Apr 3, 2008)

[-0MEGA-];941361 said:
			
		

> I was referring to people posting incorrect information in general, I wasn't saying that your post was or wasn't correct.


 
I was simply asking a question there. You'll find that everyone(excluding some of course!   ) can goof at times and then look back and think... "aw crud!  ".


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## Geoff (Apr 4, 2008)

PC eye said:


> I was simply asking a question there. You'll find that everyone(excluding some of course!   ) can goof at times and then look back and think... "aw crud!  ".


Don't get me wrong, everyone makes the occasional incorrect post.  It's the people that always post incorrect information that need to be set straight.

Anyways, back on topic!


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## PC eye (Apr 4, 2008)

Yes it's time to get focused again! Now let's see where were we again?


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## Praetor (Apr 30, 2008)

> Praetor im new, but, are you always such a nob? All the postings ive see from you have been condesending, and very unfriendly. Please excuse me and accept my apology if ive missed something, but really, do you think that everyone else has nothing to offer?





> being "shut down", is antisocial, and if that is how this forum works, than fine. I am just saying it is not exactly friendly.


You call it antisocial, which is a fair interpretation. I call it precision and accuracy. If you're wrong you're wrong, fair and square. 

In this thread, I wasnt out to "get" PC Eye -- 'sides, PC Eye's been around enough, he can handle himself (although I would like it if his posts had less of a copy-paste feel to them -- hint hint PC Eye). While the copy-paste feel of his posts does irk me, thats not what i go after..... I go after what is incorrect (to the best of my ability of course). Case in point:




			
				PC Eye said:
			
		

> What's incorrect about...? Direct3D (Microsoft) This API has become fairly common now, but it is not well-loved by programmers because of it’s finicky, chipset-dependent nature. Most 3D games released have D3D support.


In this statement, it notes that Direct3D is an API but then goes on to comment about it being chipset dependant ..... which is utterly incorrect. The whole point of an API -- application programming *interface* -- keyword, *interface*, is to provide a layer of abstraction to avoid all this "dependancy".

This is a very crucial error -- and to someone who recognizes it, really kills any 'value' in the response (note im not denying the value of his _intention_, but rather the actual technical value of the response) -- as far as I'm concerned, a well-intentionted but ultimately incorrect response/advice is likely to cause more damage than good (sorta like being prescribed the wrong medication). Here it wasnt a 'critical' scenario but it can happen (and has).


But back to what I was replying to you -- if someone is wrong, I'll isolate everything they stated that was incorrect and, to the best of my ability -- correct it. If you must think me a social monster for my mechanical approach, you're more than welcome to but that's generally not the intent .... and besides, PC Eye, i trust is smart enough to realize an invisible line of tolerance i have for "percentage of accurate posts"  Really, I was 'hardly going after him' -- it just happened that I found technical flaws in the many of his comments.



> Don't get me wrong, everyone makes the occasional incorrect post. It's the people that always post incorrect information that need to be set straight.


Bingo. I'll take cold mechanical precision over well intentioned accidental errors anyday.


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## Geoff (Apr 30, 2008)

I heard that Microsoft was ditching DX10 and going to DX7.



Hows that for well intentioned accidental errors


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## Praetor (Apr 30, 2008)

> I heard that Microsoft was ditching DX10 and going to DX7.
> Hows that for well intentioned accidental errors


That reminds me of all the threads that start with "I heard <insert ridiculous statement without any links or anything to supporting documents, quotes, sources or anything>  .... what do you guys think?" 

They naturally follow with 5 or 6 people jumping on whatever bandwagon before someone clues in and asks "where did you hear that?". Sigh.


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## Geoff (Apr 30, 2008)

Praetor said:


> That reminds me of all the threads that start with "I heard <insert ridiculous statement without any links or anything to supporting documents, quotes, sources or anything>  .... what do you guys think?"
> 
> They naturally follow with 5 or 6 people jumping on whatever bandwagon before someone clues in and asks "where did you hear that?". Sigh.


haha, I read those all the time.  I may look at it and think it's plausible, but I try not to go spreading it around as fact, as it most likely isn't true.

One of the best examples was the quote everyone put in their sig "98% of teenagers smoke, if you are part of the 2%..."


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