# Case and WaterCooling



## jellymonster

Hi,
I'm going to get a new case for my computer, I'm pretty set on the NZXT Lexa S.

I also want to get a water cooling kit but I'm not sure which one.  I found a good review on a Alphacool Xtreme 240 one, but found nowhere in England that sells it or any Alphacool products.

Does anyone have any recommendations for me?

Thanks


----------



## just a noob

kits suck, piece your own watercooling setup out


----------



## jellymonster

just a noob said:


> kits suck, piece your own watercooling setup out



Okie dokie, I expect I will have loads of questions whilst I do this.
What is a good website to use to browse water cooling pieces?


----------



## just a noob

sidewindercomputers.com is one place(if you're not in the U.S., they do ship internationally) if you live in the uk, aqua-tuning is another place, and so is watercoolinguk


----------



## bomberboysk

www.jab-tech.com is my preferred US site for watercooling.


Second, the Lexa is a piece of crap for watercooling, and the case itself isnt that great as far as quality. You may at most be able to fit a double 120 up top.


----------



## ScottALot

If you can't find a part, heatsinkfactory.com is also pretty good


----------



## jellymonster

I don't think the size of the Lexa s should be a problem because I was planning on fitting the radiators externally.  But what case would you recomend? It must look awesome! =P


----------



## ScottALot

Hm... external on a Lexa? That could actually work pretty well, but you'd have to do some drilling, etc...


----------



## jellymonster

Thanks, I got the idea from the scans jellyfish.


----------



## ScottALot

hee hee, that thing is EPIC

Have you seen last year's Great White? Now, THAT is some awesome casework!


----------



## jellymonster

ok, I'm more of a noob at this than I thought.
What components do I actually need?  Atm, I'm going start with the CPU and work up to cooling the rest of my computer.

What do I need to look for? does brand matter?

What I need is a tick list


----------



## ScottALot

One "word": BomberBoySK


----------



## diduknowthat

You'll need a pump, heatblocks for whatever you're planning to cool, tubing, clamps, a reservoir and some other small parts. Brands do matter, I can't give you much suggestion on that though.


----------



## just a noob

i have no idea what socket you're running, so i'm going to assume you're using lga 1366:
heatkiller 3.0
backplate
pump
pump top
thermochill pa120.3
reservoir
tubing
fittings(2 per block/object)
oh, and you're going to need hose clamps


----------



## bomberboysk

just a noob said:


> i have no idea what socket you're running, so i'm going to assume you're using lga 1366:
> heatkiller 3.0
> backplate
> pump
> pump top
> thermochill pa120.3
> reservoir
> tubing
> fittings(2 per block/object)
> oh, and you're going to need hose clamps


Does sidewinders even ship to the UK? If they do, with the size of that stuff it will prolly be a bit costly.

Also, you can do internal if you go for a 120.2 or feser 240 radiator.


----------



## jellymonster

oooo, it's bomberboysk himself =P, how exciting.
And sorry just a noob, I should have told you my socket, even I know that =P.  It's actually a 775, back when I bought it 1366 was megabucks.
And that setup looks good, £240 though =( my budget has just been going up and up and up, first £100 then £150 now £200 and thinking of £250 now =S.  But if that's what it takes to get a quiet, cool and awesome looking rig, I'll pay the price (Y).


----------



## jellymonster

bomberboysk said:


> Does sidewinders even ship to the UK? If they do, with the size of that stuff it will prolly be a bit costly.
> 
> Also, you can do internal if you go for a 120.2 or feser 240 radiator.



ok, that pump does look really good actually, I will probably go for that one.
http://www.chilledpc.co.uk/shop/product_info.php?products_id=181

Silly question now, what is the pump top? is it essential? what does it do?


----------



## ScOuT

If you live in the UK...might want to consider XSPC liquid cooling gear. Not only is it some of the best liquid cooling hardware made, they have retailers and shops in the UK. Very good stuff here.

http://www.xspc.biz/

I would look at 1/2 inch tubing and barbs with compression fittings with 7/16 hose. It can be hard to get the smaller tubing on the bigger barbs, just put the end in hot water for about 10 seconds and it slides right on. 

Compression fittings are a bit more money but they are rock solid and look much better than hose clamps. Many top end liquid cooling builds do just that. 

We really need to know what case? What CPU? What graphics card? What budget? These will determine actually helping you choose parts.


***EDIT***
To get some ideas for builds...
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=233842


----------



## funkysnair

xspc stuff is ok, some stuff is good but other stuff is rubish!!!

they have a decent midrange radiator, good acrylic top for ther laing ddc pumps but i wouldnt touch them for there water blocks-no way!!!!


----------



## bomberboysk

funkysnair said:


> xspc stuff is ok, some stuff is good but other stuff is rubish!!!
> 
> they have a decent midrange radiator, good acrylic top for ther laing ddc pumps but i wouldnt touch them for there water blocks-no way!!!!


Actually the higher end radiator(RX) competes directly with the feser and thermochill models while the RS series are midrange. Their tops for the Laing DDC are unparalleled however.

*Waterblocks:*
I personally run a midrange block, the apogee GTZ which is an excellent block for the price. Another good block is the Dtek Fuzion V2, but i personally prefer the GTZ as it has a great finish and good flow rate.

*Pump/Res:*
I highly recommend the XSPC Resorvoir Top for the MCP355/Laing DDC, it has been tested multiple times to have the best flow rate of any top, eliminates the need for a seperate resorvoir as well(less fittings to deal with, less tubing in the loop, more flow as well)

*Radiator:*
Most hassle free way to mount a rad in that case would be getting an RX240, Thermochill PA 120.2, or Feser 240. 

*Fittings:*
Cheaper than compressions, barbs are usually the way to go on a budget setup. Bitspower or Dangerden Fatboy barbs have the best flow rate of barbs for 1/2"

*Tubing:*
Tygon, Feser, Or Clearflex 60 for tubing, and get 1/2" ID by 3/4" OD.

*Fans:*
Honestly 120x38mm will give you the best results, however most are louder than 120x25mm fans. For 120x25mm fans i recommend the Coolermaster R4's, thats what i run and have decent results. For better cooling though, the medium speed ultra kaze, or the 120x38mm SilenX fans work pretty well.(SilenX fans are pretty pricey though)


----------



## jellymonster

bomberboysk said:


> Actually the higher end radiator(RX) competes directly with the feser and thermochill models while the RS series are midrange. Their tops for the Laing DDC are unparalleled however.
> 
> *Waterblocks:*
> I personally run a midrange block, the apogee GTZ which is an excellent block for the price. Another good block is the Dtek Fuzion V2, but i personally prefer the GTZ as it has a great finish and good flow rate.
> 
> *Pump/Res:*
> I highly recommend the XSPC Resorvoir Top for the MCP355/Laing DDC, it has been tested multiple times to have the best flow rate of any top, eliminates the need for a seperate resorvoir as well(less fittings to deal with, less tubing in the loop, more flow as well)
> 
> *Radiator:*
> Most hassle free way to mount a rad in that case would be getting an RX240, Thermochill PA 120.2, or Feser 240.
> 
> *Fittings:*
> Cheaper than compressions, barbs are usually the way to go on a budget setup. Bitspower or Dangerden Fatboy barbs have the best flow rate of barbs for 1/2"
> 
> *Tubing:*
> Tygon, Feser, Or Clearflex 60 for tubing, and get 1/2" ID by 3/4" OD.
> 
> *Fans:*
> Honestly 120x38mm will give you the best results, however most are louder than 120x25mm fans. For 120x25mm fans i recommend the Coolermaster R4's, thats what i run and have decent results. For better cooling though, the medium speed ultra kaze, or the 120x38mm SilenX fans work pretty well.(SilenX fans are pretty pricey though)



I love you man, you've just made my life so easy =) and all for less than £200.  Nice one.


----------



## bomberboysk

Also not sure if you caught it or not as i didnt very clearly say it in my post, the Pump top still requires an MCP355/Laign DDC pump, the top is just a resorvoir+top.


----------



## jellymonster

bomberboysk said:


> Also not sure if you caught it or not as i didnt very clearly say it in my post, the Pump top still requires an MCP355/Laign DDC pump, the top is just a resorvoir+top.



I did get that, I did a lil research on tops for the mcp355 just to find your reccommendation gives the best flow rate haha.


----------



## bomberboysk

jellymonster said:


> I did get that, I did a lil research on tops for the mcp355 just to find your reccommendation gives the best flow rate haha.


Hehe well of course
(I run that same top myself)


----------



## jellymonster

ok, just to verify.

I think these come in pairs so I need 3 pairs?
http://www.chilledpc.co.uk/shop/product_info.php?products_id=577

and I was gonna get 10' of tubing, too much or too little?

also I have 2 of these fans already, are they any good?
http://www.scan.co.uk/Product.aspx?WebProductID=875037&source=froogle


----------



## bomberboysk

jellymonster said:


> ok, just to verify.
> 
> I think these come in pairs so I need 3 pairs?
> http://www.chilledpc.co.uk/shop/product_info.php?products_id=577
> 
> and I was gonna get 10' of tubing, too much or too little?
> 
> also I have 2 of these fans already, are they any good?
> http://www.scan.co.uk/Product.aspx?WebProductID=875037&source=froogle


Those enermax fans arent very good, other than being somewhat quiet, airflow isnt that great.

Barbs come per fitting, not in pairs. No idea why they still take pictures of them in pairs when they are sold per fitting.


----------



## jellymonster

bomberboysk said:


> Those enermax fans arent very good, other than being somewhat quiet, airflow isnt that great.
> 
> Barbs come per fitting, not in pairs. No idea why they still take pictures of them in pairs when they are sold per fitting.



Dam, bought them for my CarPC because the specs were good (CFM looked better than rest), but now reading reviews, people say the air flow is 'mediocre'.

Probably go for the same fans you have as the main reason I'm going for water cooling is to have a near silent computer.


----------



## jellymonster

ok last questions:
is this tubing any good?
http://www.chilledpc.co.uk/shop/product_info.php?cPath=44_106_109&products_id=385

or should I get
http://specialtech.co.uk/spshop/customer/product.php?productid=4036

also, what cooling liquid is good?  or doesn't it really matter.
I saw some really really blue liquid in some guys project, looked like this stuff http://www.chilledpc.co.uk/shop/product_info.php?products_id=473.


----------



## bomberboysk

jellymonster said:


> ok last questions:
> is this tubing any good?
> http://www.chilledpc.co.uk/shop/product_info.php?cPath=44_106_109&products_id=385
> 
> or should I get
> http://specialtech.co.uk/spshop/customer/product.php?productid=4036
> 
> also, what cooling liquid is good?  or doesn't it really matter.
> I saw some really really blue liquid in some guys project, looked like this stuff http://www.chilledpc.co.uk/shop/product_info.php?products_id=473.


First is only the coils for around the tubing, not the tubing itself.

If you want color, run colored tubing, for the coolant distilled water is best and will provide the best temperatures as well as cheapest. For blue, this is decent stuff:
http://specialtech.co.uk/spshop/customer/product.php?productid=4547&cat=1238&page=1


----------



## jellymonster

ok, found tygon tubing on that site, just gonna use that:
http://www.chilledpc.co.uk/shop/product_info.php?cPath=44_116_147&products_id=331

but I need to know what coolant I should go for?  Not sure what colour I want, blue seems like it will go the best =)

edit: soz bomber didn't see previous post =)


----------



## jellymonster

ok, going for clear tubing =)

how much tubing do I need though?  10 feet enough?  and I'm guessing when buying tubing, the price is per foot.

http://www.chilledpc.co.uk/shop/product_info.php?products_id=382  coolant?
how much coolant do I need?  I'm guessing that I don't dilute it at all.

Also, will one of these work well?
http://www.chilledpc.co.uk/shop/product_info.php?cPath=67_78&products_id=140
http://www.chilledpc.co.uk/shop/product_info.php?cPath=67_78&products_id=143
I'm actually thinking the purple will look pretty cool and unique.  But will they show up well?  or are they just under UV lamp =S


----------



## jellymonster

Ok, got all of my things now. So far it's gone fairly well. Mounted the radiator externally ontop of the case, just waiting for some fittings for it now as it has much bigger threads than I thought.
I'm already thinking of water cooling my gpu (thread here: http://www.computerforum.com/166669-best-9800gtx-1gb-water-block.html

when it's finished I will post some pictures and results, I will also start a new thread on asthetics and what you guys think will look awesome (Y).  Looking forward to hearing your replies.

Thanks everyone for all your input, have a happy new year


----------



## jasonwow

looking forward to the results goodluck


----------



## jellymonster

Hi again, sorry for the lack of updates, things haven't been going my way tbh.

Firstly I put the water cooling together (didn't test or anything, it went straight into my computer) and..... it leaker...... everywhere.  The radiator leaker >_>.  Bomberboysk, you're a legend for recommending non-conductive coolant, saved my computer.
Then about a week after, I wrote of my car =(.  (attached a picture)  Managed to fix it though, insurance suck at quoting >_>

So yesterday I received a new radiator and a few other bits I ordered (MCW60 for my graphics card) and put it together in the case, this time without the computer inside.  (attached image with and without coolant).

Just one thing though, I left it running and there were a lot of bubbles.  Wobbled it, stopped pump, did everything I could and there are still quite a lot of bubbles.  What am I doing wrong?

In case you can't see the setup in the picture it's basically:
Pump/Res -> T-line -> Rad -> CPU -> GPU -> Pump/Res

I know it's odd to have T-Line and res, but I use T-Line to drain it.

Help please =)


----------



## MacBook

You need a way for the air to escape, open up the fill port on the reservoir when it's running.


----------



## jellymonster

MacBook said:


> You need a way for the air to escape, open up the fill port on the reservoir when it's running.



I had done that, you see in the picture with coolant in, the Res cap is off, and a tube is sticking out of it.

I've left it off overnight, so hopefully the small bubbles would have gathered into larger bubbles and will be easier to move.


----------



## just a noob

wait, why do you have a t-line, and a res top?


----------



## jellymonster

jellymonster said:


> I know it's odd to have T-Line and res, but I use T-Line to drain it.



I just found it easier than draining it from the Res.
I have a res, because it's a better top for the pump than the stock one.

I didn't see a problem by doing this, but this is my first water cooling setup so I could be wrong?


----------



## just a noob

i dunno, but i think part of you problem with bleeding could be that the radiator is at the top of the loop, so tip the case on its front so that your t-line is the highest point, and shake the case while you pulse the pump(make sure it never goes dry though)


----------



## jellymonster

just a noob said:


> i dunno, but i think part of you problem with bleeding could be that the radiator is at the top of the loop, so tip the case on its front so that your t-line is the highest point, and shake the case while you pulse the pump(make sure it never goes dry though)



That's what I thought it could be, I did try tipping it a little bit, but not massively (I'm still a bit scared of it leaking so I'm delicate with it).

Tip it on it's front?  I would imagine tipping it on it's back would be better 
I'll try some more tippage when I get home from work.

Do you think I will harm the system if I put the Res cap on and tipped the system upside down?


----------



## bomberboysk

jellymonster said:


> That's what I thought it could be, I did try tipping it a little bit, but not massively (I'm still a bit scared of it leaking so I'm delicate with it).
> 
> Tip it on it's front?  I would imagine tipping it on it's back would be better
> I'll try some more tippage when I get home from work.
> 
> Do you think I will harm the system if I put the Res cap on and tipped the system upside down?


Make sure the res cap is on tight, and it shouldnt leak(a penny works well to tighten the res top's cap).


----------



## jellymonster

Ok I'm nearly there. The system is still making a wierd rattling sound (where I think bubble may be?).  But it is coming from the CPU block, there are no bubbles going innor out of it. I have shaken it but it is still rattling.  Is this normal? If not what could it be?


----------



## bomberboysk

jellymonster said:


> Ok I'm nearly there. The system is still making a wierd rattling sound (where I think bubble may be?).  But it is coming from the CPU block, there are no bubbles going innor out of it. I have shaken it but it is still rattling.  Is this normal? If not what could it be?



Take the cpu block off and then shake it around a bit with the tubing attached, could be an air pocket in the top of the block.


----------



## jellymonster

The system is set up inside the case without my computer in. I've shaken it around quite alot with and without the pump on. Still rattles.


----------



## jellymonster

I think I'm gonna drain it and see if there's anything inside it. It sounds like a little bit of metal rattling around =S


----------



## bomberboysk

jellymonster said:


> I think I'm gonna drain it and see if there's anything inside it. It sounds like a little bit of metal rattling around =S



Yeah that would be bad, perhaps what may be causing the issue is the small plastic tab inside the GTZ block that helps increase pressure inside the block may be loose. You'll need some hex keys/allen wrenches to get inside the block.


----------



## jellymonster

Took it apart today, couldn't see anything loose inside. It still rattles quite loudly.

Could it just be tiny bubbles going through it?
I've been bleeding it for a long time today.

Any offer tips on bleeding my system?


----------



## jellymonster

Just took it apart again, and I think I just found the bit of plastic that you was taking about.  What would you reccommend me to do with it? Take it out? Glue it? Push it in?


----------



## jellymonster

Just ordered R4-L2R-20AC-GP =)  (Cooler Master R4's Blue).

I am going to remount the Radiator.  To fit it in my current setup I screwed the fans inside the case from the top of the case, and double sided sticky taped the Rad on top =S.  How would you guys fit it?  I did originally think self tapping screws, but the only ones that I could find were too long and would go through the rad =(.

Also, I still need my previous question answered =)  I might just take it out and see how it goes, or is it important? in which case I'll glue it?

Thanks


----------



## bomberboysk

jellymonster said:


> Just took it apart again, and I think I just found the bit of plastic that you was taking about.  What would you reccommend me to do with it? Take it out? Glue it? Push it in?



place it back in if it was loose, shouldn't be any need for adhesives.


----------



## jellymonster

Arg, I think I'm going to cry with frustration. It's still rattling, I resorted in super glueing it in place... And it still rattles. I have left it running for hours on and off for he last few nights. I can see no bubbles and no foaming of the coolant. I really can't think what else it could be.
I may just put it all togther and hope it goes away over time maybe =(


----------



## jellymonster

Got my Cooler Master R4's =)  good choice fans, luv em'

Plugged them into my fan controllers on my NZXT Lexa S case but when I turn them to the lowest setting, it makes some weird humming noise on and off.

I have to put them half on to keep it quiet without that humming noise, is that normal?

Lastly, my Apogee GTZ is still making that annoying rattling, and it's not getting better =(  anyone got any other ideas on what I can do?

Probably post pictures tomorrow =)

Thanks all
JM


----------



## bomberboysk

jellymonster said:


> Got my Cooler Master R4's =)  good choice fans, luv em'
> 
> Plugged them into my fan controllers on my NZXT Lexa S case but when I turn them to the lowest setting, it makes some weird humming noise on and off.
> 
> I have to put them half on to keep it quiet without that humming noise, is that normal?
> 
> Lastly, my Apogee GTZ is still making that annoying rattling, and it's not getting better =(  anyone got any other ideas on what I can do?
> 
> Probably post pictures tomorrow =)
> 
> Thanks all
> JM


Can you better describe the rattle? Or even get an audio/video recording of it, that would help immensely.

The R4's need to be turned up enough so they are moving fast enough for the bearings, the bearings in them arent designed to be super slow(the fans are pretty quiet though as is, and more airflow is always better).


----------



## jellymonster

bomberboysk said:


> Can you better describe the rattle? Or even get an audio/video recording of it, that would help immensely.
> 
> The R4's need to be turned up enough so they are moving fast enough for the bearings, the bearings in them arent designed to be super slow(the fans are pretty quiet though as is, and more airflow is always better).



ok, I'll do it tonight.  Just created a youtube account lol.

Yeah, the fans are very quiet even on half power, it's nice =)


----------



## bomberboysk

jellymonster said:


> ok, I'll do it tonight.  Just created a youtube account lol.
> 
> Yeah, the fans are very quiet even on half power, it's nice =)



Basically with the fans, higher speed is better though as far as temps


----------



## jellymonster

bomberboysk said:


> Basically with the fans, higher speed is better though as far as temps



of course, I put them on high speeds whilst gaming, watching movies and stuff half speed.


----------



## jellymonster

Here is a video of my Rig:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2TYEx9Mqkuw

You may need to turn the your speakers up a bit to hear the rattle.

Any diagnostics would be great =)


----------



## Theblackoutow

I hear a crackling type noise, which sounds like a piece of debris in a fan or something bouncing around inside the plastic. Maybe try to clean it out well, and use a air canister.


----------



## jellymonster

Theblackoutow said:


> I hear a crackling type noise, which sounds like a piece of debris in a fan or something bouncing around inside the plastic. Maybe try to clean it out well, and use a air canister.



It's not coming from the fans, it's from the CPU block.  I can just have the pump on and it will still make that noise.

I have taken it apart twice and there is nothing inside. Sometimes it's not that bad, other times it is worse =S


----------



## Theblackoutow

I don't know why, have you tried seeing if any of the plasting on the CPU block was loose?


----------



## bomberboysk

jellymonster said:


> It's not coming from the fans, it's from the CPU block.  I can just have the pump on and it will still make that noise.
> 
> I have taken it apart twice and there is nothing inside. Sometimes it's not that bad, other times it is worse =S



Sounds almost like it isnt bled properly and has some air in the block. the block needs to be taken off the cpu but still attached to the hoses, and then place it so the base is horizontal and leave it like that for an hour or so to remove any air bubbles in the cpu block. If that doesnt work....contact swiftech.


Also....make sure the inlet and outlet are setup correctly. The inlet should be the lower barb, and outlet the higher barb. 

Whats with the T-line? You shouldnt need a t line for a single loop, should have the tubing going like this with no extra fittings: Pump Outlet->Radiator->CPU Block->Back to Pump.


----------



## jellymonster

Yeah, the only bit hat came off was some pressure thing Which I ended up glueing in place


----------



## jellymonster

bomberboysk said:


> Sounds almost like it isnt bled properly and has some air in the block. the block needs to be taken off the cpu but still attached to the hoses, and then place it so the base is horizontal and leave it like that for an hour or so to remove any air bubbles in the cpu block. If that doesnt work....contact swiftech.



Ok, I'll try that later on.



bomberboysk said:


> Also....make sure the inlet and outlet are setup correctly. The inlet should be the lower barb, and outlet the higher barb.



The inlet and outlet are definitely the correct way around.



bomberboysk said:


> Whats with the T-line? You shouldnt need a t line for a single loop, should have the tubing going like this with no extra fittings: Pump Outlet->Radiator->CPU Block->Back to Pump.



My setup is as you said, just with a T-Line added after the pump and GPU block after CPU block.  I did it for ease of draining.  Do you think that this would be a problem?

Thanks


----------



## bomberboysk

jellymonster said:


> Ok, I'll try that later on.
> 
> 
> 
> The inlet and outlet are definitely the correct way around.
> 
> 
> 
> My setup is as you said, just with a T-Line added after the pump and GPU block after CPU block.  I did it for ease of draining.  Do you think that this would be a problem?
> 
> Thanks



personally I don't run a t-line, because I have enough room with the tubing to move the pump a few inches out of my case and into a bucket, at which point I disconnect the output side. The tline also may be hindering proper drainage.


----------



## jellymonster

I out the computer on it's side, so the base of the block is horizontal and left it running for a few hours. I. Didn't get any better.

I did realise as I turned it on, that it is almost silent but then when left for a few minutes it starts to rattle.  Could this is where bubbles are stuck to the sides of stuff and the water movement then makes them flow round the system?


----------



## bomberboysk

jellymonster said:


> I out the computer on it's side, so the base of the block is horizontal and left it running for a few hours. I. Didn't get any better.
> 
> I did realise as I turned it on, that it is almost silent but then when left for a few minutes it starts to rattle. Could this is where bubbles are stuck to the sides of stuff and the water movement then makes them flow round the system?


 Unscrew the waterblock from the cpu, jumpstart the PSU so your computer itself isnt running(Place a wire connecting the green wire on the 24pin atx connector to any of the black wires). Then shake the cpu block a bit so that air bubbles can get out(have the top off your res as well to let some air out of the system).

Also...your cpu block is mounted as tight as it gets, correct?


----------

