# help with watercooling



## wolfeking (Jul 18, 2012)

Okay, I had a brilliant idea, and bigfella suggested make a thread, so here it is. 

It will be a while off, probably September, but I want to do a custom water cooled system with mine. I don't know anything about this, so clueless. I know I want one loop that would run the CPU, and probably RAM if that can be water cooled. One loop for 2 480s, or maybe go 3 way SLI with a Fatality board, if I can get one. Hoping to do 5GHz CPU, 1866 8-9-8-24 RAM and 900 MHz on the GPUz.  Not sure how to do it though. Or what parts to get or anything.  

I  think I am going with a full tower Switch 810 in Gunmetal, so that will be what the loop will go in.  Guessing 400 max budget to start with. That will give me enough to get the case and motherboard and PSU, and the loop. If it cost more, then  I can get the CPU loop first and go with the GPU case, motherboard, and PSU then, then do Dual SLI and GPU loop at that time. 

idk, not really sure.


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## claptonman (Jul 18, 2012)

Not sure on all the water cooling stuff, but I would not watercool the RAM. It'd be a waste of money unless you're really overclocking it. The timings you had are entirely possible, almost stock:

16GB:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231539

8GB:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231538


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## wolfeking (Jul 18, 2012)

noted, but I can probably do 8-9-8-24 2T with what I have. 

If I was to get new RAM I would want to get Patriot or Kingston. That is mainly because I like the square look. To me the rounded look of ripjaws just does not suit me.


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## Okedokey (Jul 18, 2012)

Yeah DDR3 doesn't get hot really.  Not worth it.  Get a loop for your CPU and a loop for your GPUs.

You'll need:


2 x 240 mm x 120mm hi flow radiators
A dual bay, dual loop reservoir.
Pump.
CPU waterblock with 1/8 fittings 
2 x GPU waterblocks with 1/8 fittings
Non-conductive high quality thermal paste (thermal pads usually come with the GPU waterblocks for VRAM and chokes).
Compression fittings for each of the above (1/8")
1.5 m Tubing (1/8 internal diameter)
Anti-corrosive coolant
Isopropyl alcohol to clean old thermal paste off

What you need to do first.


Read the http://www.computerforum.com/206174-how-liquid-cooling-101-a.html
Forget about silver coils - its bollocks
Confirm your GPUs have a reference design (if you're unsure, pull one of the heat sink off and take a photo)


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## wolfeking (Jul 18, 2012)

okay, my GPU is reference I think. I would pull the heatsink, but I don't know how. Never worked on a GPU in the past. Ill look up a guide and come back later with that, probably late today or tomorrow (im 12 hour priming my system for OCN). 

Silver sounds like it would make the water rust, doesn't it? 

I have been using the same wipes that I use for my 70/30 injections to remove thermal paste. They will work for this too, yes? 




are the ones. 

Coolant should be able to get from the same place I get the parts? 

GOing to read the guide and see what I have as far as questions there first. Then Ill try and find some parts.


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## wolfeking (Jul 18, 2012)

okay, I think I have it. Pretty sure anyway. The guide was very understandable, and I will watch a few vids between now and buying to be sure of it. 

Basic parts I think would be like these: 
(CPU block) http://www.frozencpu.com/products/1...Block_-_No_Fittings_.html?tl=g30c85s139#blank
(RAD x2) http://www.frozencpu.com/products/1...HX-240HL_No_Nozzles_.html?tl=g30c95s160#blank
(pump (2?)) http://www.frozencpu.com/products/2...version_Kit_317_GPH.html?tl=g30c107s153#blank
(GPU Block) http://www.ekwb.com/shop/blocks/vga-blocks/fc-geforce/4x0-gtx-series/ek-fc480-gtx-acetal.html 

I could not find the GPU block on either of the sites I was looking at, so got to search for an american company to buy from. The EK site is in euros, so I would have to apply the fees to that too. Not sure what the bank charges for international transactions, been a while on that. 

does this look good so far?  Still looking for reserviors and tubes and fittings and such.


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## Okedokey (Jul 18, 2012)

Yeah looks good so far.  Btw where I have said 1/8 above I meant 3/8 (10mm approx).

Just google your card and make sure its reference.  Google the model number on the box if possible.

You can get compression fittings here: http://www.frozencpu.com/cat/l3/g30...gs-Compression-14_x_38_Compression-Page1.html

Check that if your case will fit the horizontal fittings and the radiator length pluse 1.5 pipe width.

Otherwise get a verticial fitting rad.

Pump-housing and reservoir wise you could consider something like this http://www.frozencpu.com/products/1...2-Loop_G14_-_Black_Acetal.html?tl=g30c107s152

Then buy two pumps and install them in that.

Or you could just get this http://www.frozencpu.com/products/1...5_Variant_Pumps_Installed.html?tl=g30c107s152  but make sure you get the MPC655-B pumps (same as the D5).

Get Tygon hose and anticorrosive (2L) coolant.

Around 10 connectors (check).

Write yourself a diagram and post it up.


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## wolfeking (Jul 18, 2012)

I don't know exactly what model my card is. I got it off Ebay, and all it came with was the anti-static bag and about 100x the amount of packing peanuts that it needed. It looks to be a reference EVGA though, like http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130759. It looks exactly like that. 

might sound like a dumb question, but why do the pumps need a housing? couldn't they be bolted to the bottom of the case as they are?   If there is a reason to the housing I will get it, but i don't want to spend $90 on it if I don't have to. 

the case seems to have enough room. The Newegg list says 





> Supports high-end water cooling solutions up to three fans for push and pull configuration: 90mm of internal top space with top 360 / 420mm and bottom 140 / 240mm radiator support for unmatched liquid cooling
> 
> Four watercooling cutouts for easy liquid cooling management on the rear panel



Diagram, you mean like a wire diagram for the loop? like 2 dimensional?


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## just a noob (Jul 18, 2012)

wolfeking said:


> I don't know exactly what model my card is. I got it off Ebay, and all it came with was the anti-static bag and about 100x the amount of packing peanuts that it needed. It looks to be a reference EVGA though, like http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130759. It looks exactly like that.
> 
> might sound like a dumb question, but why do the pumps need a housing? couldn't they be bolted to the bottom of the case as they are?   If there is a reason to the housing I will get it, but i don't want to spend $90 on it if I don't have to.
> 
> ...



So you can use your own fittings, there's also some increase in performance, but not nearly as much if you were to use an aftermarket top on a ddc. 

Also try looking at:
sidewindercomputers.com
jab-tech.com
aquatuning.us


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## Okedokey (Jul 19, 2012)

The housing is also the reservoir.  So you need it.

Yes, draw a diagram of how you intend to connect things up.


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## wolfeking (Jul 19, 2012)

here is my diagram. H100 and air. 

Sorry. But the way yall are talking Im going to end up with $1200 in cooling on a $900 computer. It would be a pyrrhic victory.


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## jonnyp11 (Jul 19, 2012)

Can't you grab extra tubing and a gpu block and make a loop that way? you'd just need a bit more fluid in there though but it seems like it'd work as long as the pump is strong enough.


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## wolfeking (Jul 19, 2012)

no. that will not work. If I am going to make my case look like a drunk man assembled it, then I might as well add some stray wires and paint it camo.  

The system will just stay as it is stock. Its not worth it to change it at all.


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## just a noob (Jul 20, 2012)

wolfeking said:


> no. that will not work. If I am going to make my case look like a drunk man assembled it, then I might as well add some stray wires and paint it camo.
> 
> The system will just stay as it is stock. Its not worth it to change it at all.



It has been done before, but the outcome is what you stated; it looked like ass.


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## wolfeking (Jul 20, 2012)

yea. 

Im going to go through this again and see what I can find. Also going to draw up the diagram in a bit and upload it. So, be back in a few.  

Also, I saw a build over at OCN where the guy used copper pipes to do his loop. How hard would that be to pull off? http://www.overclock.net/t/1212455/mkg-cosmos-ii-case-mod is it to be exact. I like the look, but not sure I could pull it off. I mean, a pipe cutter and bender is necessary, and I have both, but what size pipe, and how hard would it be to make the connection to the rads and such?  Then again, I could break out the welder and use elbows. Either sounds easy enough.


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## just a noob (Jul 20, 2012)

wolfeking said:


> yea.
> 
> Im going to go through this again and see what I can find. Also going to draw up the diagram in a bit and upload it. So, be back in a few.
> 
> Also, I saw a build over at OCN where the guy used copper pipes to do his loop. How hard would that be to pull off? http://www.overclock.net/t/1212455/mkg-cosmos-ii-case-mod is it to be exact. I like the look, but not sure I could pull it off. I mean, a pipe cutter and bender is necessary, and I have both, but what size pipe, and how hard would it be to make the connection to the rads and such?  Then again, I could break out the welder and use elbows. Either sounds easy enough.



Guide for bending the pipe
Pipe(pretty sure it's 12mm od)
and then you use something similar to these fittings


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## wolfeking (Jul 20, 2012)

cool. Does not sound hard at all. And it will be very clean looking.   

Now to finish the diagram and upload it.


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## wolfeking (Jul 20, 2012)

bigfellla said:


> The housing is also the reservoir.  So you need it.
> 
> Yes, draw a diagram of how you intend to connect things up.



forgive my ignorance, but cant something like http://www.frozencpu.com/products/1...Meter_-_Acetal_White.html?tl=g30c97s168#blank be used? In which case mount it above the pump and pipe the water to the pump?


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## just a noob (Jul 20, 2012)

wolfeking said:


> forgive my ignorance, but cant something like http://www.frozencpu.com/products/1...Meter_-_Acetal_White.html?tl=g30c97s168#blank be used? In which case mount it above the pump and pipe the water to the pump?



Yes, just make sure that the reservoir is always above the intake of the pump


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## wolfeking (Jul 20, 2012)

I know that one.  Auto knowhow pays off again.  

And saves about $200 also.


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## wolfeking (Jul 20, 2012)

okay. Diagram. sort of.  Could not get it quite right with a ruler on paper, so I used Paint.


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## just a noob (Jul 20, 2012)

The only thing I can really see wrong is that you would want to add in a second radiator or run everything in series


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## wolfeking (Jul 20, 2012)

I know I need 2 radiators. Not sure where I would put it though. Probably external. Weld up a brace for it to sit on top of the case leaving enough space for the internal one to have execellent flow.


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## FuryRosewood (Jul 21, 2012)

Run a thick rad at the back where the 120mm fan is, run a thinner but 240 mm rad up top? thats all i could think of...otherwise might be able to bolt a 120mm or something up in the front where the 5.25 bays are at.


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## Machin3 (Jul 21, 2012)

Man, to be honest if I were you, I would run everything in one continuous loop. If your going to to 2 loops then that's gonna cost you a bit. Besides, I don't really know if there's a point in doing that. I've seen people WC with 4 video cards and a cpu on one loop and still get amazing temps.

All you need to do is get at least a triple fan radiator and then at least a single or double fan radiator. 

Otherwise with 2 pumps sucking on one resevoir, you'l probably create unneeded pressure inside. 

And that Dual MCP-355X2 pump Bigfella suggested is rediculous overkill. This is going into a switch 810 not a caselabs TX10.


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## wolfeking (Jul 21, 2012)

okay, what parts would you suggest to get it up and running cooling 3 480s (SLI and a dedicated folder) and a 2600k in a switch 810 or similar sized case?  I don't need overkill. 9TB RAID and 480s are my overkill on it.  PLus there is only a year till it gets replaces with Haswell and a LGA 1150 in a Z87 or whatever they make for it.  But the loop should just need a new CPU block for that, so no worries.  

Anyway, what would cool all this well? you seems to know your stuff, so Ill probably go with your suggestions.


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## Machin3 (Jul 21, 2012)

If you like to be creative, and this is just a suggestion, you can put a nice thick triple fan radiator on top like an xspc rx series or similar, and like i said, creativity and planning, you can remove the bottom plate in the case next to the single fan mount to uncover it to be dual and install a dual fan radiator on the bottom of the case. And finally you can install a single fan radiator on the exhaust in the back (optional). 

You'll probably have to drill a couple of holes on the mobo tray to mount the pump and res. It will be kind of tight but, like I said with time, patience and planning, it can all get done. 

I was looking at some friend's builds to see what they did if you want a place for ideas  _(not promoting anything btw, just not gonna post huge pictures on here.)_

http://www.overclock.net/t/1269782/...xt-switch-810-water-cooled/0_20#post_17497793

Here's 2 radiator config: 1x triple fan & 1x single fan:


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## just a noob (Jul 21, 2012)

Go with two pumps in a single loop for redundancy, there will also be no extra pressure created in the reservoir...


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## Machin3 (Jul 21, 2012)

There's really no point though going with 2 pumps. The case is not that big that you need that much power in it. An MCP655 will do plenty. My case is bigger and STILL works plenty good on a 655 pump, especially since im going through 3 radiators and 2 blocks.

Listen guys, not trying to be a troll or anything, but there is really no point in wasting money on another pump. He always has the option on changing his loop to meet his requirements, but adding in another pump is much overkill.

From the looks of it, it will only be 4 blocks. (1 cpu and 3 video card) plus 1 or 2 radiators. A 655 pump is more than sufficient for that config considering that you can set the flow speed on the pump.


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## wolfeking (Jul 22, 2012)

Redundancy is not needed i don't think.  Because if one fails, then it will not be pushing water, and thus will back up the system, yes?


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## just a noob (Jul 22, 2012)

wolfeking said:


> Redundancy is not needed i don't think.  Because if one fails, then it will not be pushing water, and thus will back up the system, yes?



no, it will keep pumping regardless. And pumps do fail, I actually had a ddc die on my desk and it left a burn mark(swiftech gave me the bird and said I done it)


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## wolfeking (Jul 22, 2012)

okay, I don't see how.  If teh pump motor goes out, then what, its free turning? so the other pump will be pushing water through it?


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## just a noob (Jul 22, 2012)

the impeller actually sits on a ceramic bearing, and then the stator causes it to rotate with a magnetic field, so yeah


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## wolfeking (Jul 22, 2012)

okay, I think I get it. The pump motor is just a stator and with no electricity, its free floating.


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## Okedokey (Jul 22, 2012)

You are not going to get good temps with one RAD on that system -period.

And don't worry about the pump failing, thats bollocks, you can easliy set your machine to shut down at a temp threshold.


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## wolfeking (Oct 19, 2012)

okay. Resurrection! lol. 

Anyway, I have been looking, and thinking, and looking a lot recently (like in the last 2 hour or so) and have had an idea. That idea being I know nothing of water cooling in a nutshell, so maybe someone makes a kit that I can lego together to be sure everything is compatible, and that I do not miss anything.  And I found a few, but I don't know how good they are. 
http://www.frozencpu.com/products/1...ling_Kit_w_Free_Dead-Water.html?tl=g30c83s137 (probably no good at all) 
http://www.frozencpu.com/products/1...er_240_DDCXT_-_Kit.html?tl=g30c321s1793#blank 
http://www.frozencpu.com/products/1...EK-KIT_H3O_240_HFX.html?tl=g30c321s1367#blank (I like this one) 

Going with a 240mm because I do not have room for a 360 mm in my case (HAF912). I do have room for 2x240 and 1x120 though. Which is way overkill, but may be an option in the future. 
All I am going to running for right now is a 2600k @ 5GHz+ (depending on what I can get stable). Hoping to get temps lower than a closed loop system. So probably running a 240 with a 120 for CPU only?  And future GPU upgrade go to 2x240 and 1x120? 

The idea for the setup, at least for now, is to have the Resv. in the optical bays, the pump bolted to the top of the 2.5" HDD bay, the 240 rad up top and the 120 out back. 
Want clear tubing, and no dyes or anything that is not necessary. 

am I dreaming, or will this work okay?


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## Buzz1927 (Oct 21, 2012)

This kit is better, good pump and you've got the res in the optical bays.
http://www.frozencpu.com/products/1..._Included_and_Free_Dead-Water.html?tl=g30c321


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## wolfeking (Oct 21, 2012)

would you recommend that I go and build it myself? I have gone through that site and tried already, but I don't know how good it would be for the price. Came out to 321.63 without fittings and clamps (because I forgot to add them up) 

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/1...uctive_Thermal_Compound_4g.html?tl=g8c127s769  (This should be good, yes?  I'm out of AS5, so I am hoping this is good, or I will just go back to AS5) 
(4x) http://www.frozencpu.com/products/1...0mm_Fan_CO-9050007-WW.html?tl=g36c15s60#blank (high static pressure is for rads, yes? If these are not good, then could you recommend some good fans?) 
http://www.frozencpu.com/products/1...Ready_Apogee-HD-BK.html?tl=g30c325s1118#blank (I have no clue on water blocks, but I assume it is good. It at least looks good. What would you recommend if it is not good?) 
(10x) http://www.frozencpu.com/products/2121/ex-mis-01/38_ID_-_12OD_PVC_Clear_Tubing.html?tl=g30c99s171  (just tube, not much more) 
http://www.frozencpu.com/products/2...-_Clear_Silver_Black.html?tl=g30c97s168#blank (cheap resv.  370ml capacity. Sounds big, but not sure. Is a dual bay one even necessary?) 
http://www.frozencpu.com/products/2...version_Kit_317_GPH.html?tl=g30c107s153#blank (Pump. expensive. But I have herd about it, and it looks like a good pump I think.) 
http://www.frozencpu.com/products/1...ter_-_1_Gallon_PC-BASE128.html?tl=g30c103s753 (Its water. What more is to be said?  Or could I just get some distilled water at the store to use?) 
http://www.frozencpu.com/products/5...treme_240_Radiator_-_Black.html?tl=g30c95s160 (rad. Not sure if it is good, but the marketing makes it look good) 

so with all that, with the exception of any changes all I will need is 4 barbs and 6-10 hose clamps to be done?  how would the performance be compared to a kit like the XSPC one?


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## Buzz1927 (Oct 23, 2012)

wolfeking said:


> would you recommend that I go and build it myself? I have gone through that site and tried already, but I don't know how good it would be for the price. Came out to 321.63 without fittings and clamps (because I forgot to add them up)
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/1...uctive_Thermal_Compound_4g.html?tl=g8c127s769  (This should be good, yes?  I'm out of AS5, so I am hoping this is good, or I will just go back to AS5)
> (4x) http://www.frozencpu.com/products/1...0mm_Fan_CO-9050007-WW.html?tl=g36c15s60#blank (high static pressure is for rads, yes? If these are not good, then could you recommend some good fans?)
> ...


That thermal paste is good, it's what I use 
Never seen those fans, fan choice depends on the rad (see below)
Most cpu blocks will give similar temps, get the one you like the look of!
If you're cramped for room in the case, a bay res is good, the one in the kit I linked houses the pump as well (hence using 2 slots). Again down to your personal preference.
Pump is good, you might be able to get one cheaper just a different brand.
Just get some distilled water from the hardware store and use a silver coil.
That rad is 20fpi (fins per inch), the more fpi the more powerful fans you need, you should get a fan controller whatever rad you go with, depends on how quiet you want things.
I'd also use compression fittings over barbs, safer and look much better.

Whatever you do, when you first put it in the case, cover all your components with towels and tissues and run the loop for 24 hours to check for leaks, cross your fingers and hope you don't fry your comp!


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## Okedokey (Oct 23, 2012)

Do not add silver.  Just add anticorrosive. 

Silver will root your system.  This is why some distributers no longer stock it.

http://www.gammods.com.au/store/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=1_90_1133

and



> The introduction of additional metals into the system (*silver*, etc.) or
> the use of ionic algaecides (copper sulfate, etc.) even in minor concentrations can trigger the corrosion processes.


 http://www.ekwb.com/shop/EK-IMAGES/Corrosion_Report_Final.pdf


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## Buzz1927 (Oct 23, 2012)

bigfellla said:


> Do not add silver.  Just add anticorrosive.
> 
> Silver will root your system.  This is why some distributers no longer stock it.
> 
> ...


Funny how you linked to the EK website, they were the only products that had a problem with silver!  And as the OP doesn't intend using EK......

I've been using it for years without any problems, and most people who watercool would use nothing else.


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## Okedokey (Oct 23, 2012)

Buzz1927 said:


> Funny how you linked to the EK website, they were the only products that had a problem with silver!  And as the OP doesn't intend using EK......
> 
> I've been using it for years without any problems, and most people who watercool would use nothing else.



Chemistry doesn't differentiate with brands...

I also linked to another resource, you forgot to mention that.  Silver (not pure), and any other metal will increase corrosion, and is not neccessary in todays WC loops.


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## wolfeking (Oct 23, 2012)

bigfellla said:


> Do not add silver.  Just add anticorrosive.
> 
> Silver will root your system.  This is why some distributers no longer stock it.
> 
> ...


Anti-corrosive sounds like a better option than silver anyway. 




Buzz1927 said:


> That thermal paste is good, it's what I use
> Never seen those fans, fan choice depends on the rad (see below)
> Most cpu blocks will give similar temps, get the one you like the look of!
> If you're cramped for room in the case, a bay res is good, the one in the kit I linked houses the pump as well (hence using 2 slots). Again down to your personal preference.
> ...


okay, I think what I am actually going to do is grab one of the Rasa kits to use, mainly so I will have enough $$ to grab a graphics card too. 

And noted on the thermal paste. I will probably grab some of that too, as well as the corsair fans.


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